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sniper297 (1074 posts)
Dec-14-01, 07:31 PM (EST) "Controlling AI traffic train speed" Am I missing something, or is there a way to control AI train speed? The AI train seems to move at assorted speeds depending on the consist, but I want it to slow down when approaching a junction point, then speed up again. I tried putting in speed zones in the route editor, unfortunately that covers the parallel track too, which I don't want, and it don't work right for the AI train anyhow, which slows down for the reduced speed marker, then stops at the resume speed marker and won't start again. So I took all the speed limits out of the route and added temporary speed zones in the activity editor, and altho it doesn't affect the parallel track the AI train does the same thing, slowing down when it's supposed to slow down, but stopping when it's supposed to resume speed. I'm posting this in both activity and route design forums, since the two are interdependent, and I feel the need for speed, I'm tumbleweed. Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
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Subject Author Message Date ID RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... rgarber Dec-14-01 1 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... sniper297 Dec-14-01 2 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... lwhelan Dec-14-01 3 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... sniper297 Dec-14-01 5 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... rgarber Dec-14-01 4 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... sniper297 Dec-15-01 6 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... TOPDOG5184 Dec-15-01 7 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... rgarber Dec-15-01 8 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... sniper297 Dec-16-01 9 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... TOPDOG5184 Dec-16-01 10 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... sniper297 Dec-16-01 11 RE: Controlling AI traffic train sp... BFree Dec-16-01 12

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rgarber (840 posts)
Dec-14-01, 07:34 PM (EST) 1. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" LAST EDITED ON Dec-14-01 AT 07:43 PM (EST)People do this by different means. One is to change the Player Expected performance for the AI train. By lowering it, it slows the AI train down. You can also throw wait points in which seem to bring the AI train to the pause.Hope this helps. hey Jim... check out this thread.. look for the one about signals ahead num (or whatever...) I had a suggestion afterwards that might be perfect for what you're trying to do.http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID7/585.htmlRich Garber Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (1074 posts)
Dec-14-01, 07:45 PM (EST) 2. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" Nope, it don't help. I don't want to slow it down over the entire tour, I want it to slow to 10mph approching the converging points so I have a longer warning time on the signals before the switch changes, then I want it to speed up again and get it's fat ugly caboose out of my way. Neither method seems to work, the dumb thing says "OK, reduced speed, slow down. OK, resume speed, stop." Maybe that's the problem, gotta change the starting and ending speeds. I'll be back. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
lwhelan (38 posts)
Dec-14-01, 08:53 PM (EST) 3. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" HI Jim and Rich,My experience with AI trains is that they seem to completely ignore the speed signs but haven't experienced the stopping at resume signs. Don't think they exceed the main route speed (default 80mph) though.
However they do seem to obey the activity 'Restricted Speed Zone' even to the extent that they wait until the end of the consist is clear of the zone before resuming normal speed.
But that is only a temporary type fix as it depends on activities not the route setup.Maybe we need that man with the red flag who used to walk in front of those early English trains?Cheers,
Laurie Whelan
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sniper297 (1074 posts)
Dec-14-01, 09:28 PM (EST) 5. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" Used to have that in America too. That's what we need, Rich, hire a bunch of former skivvy-wavers for each junction. If they're as intellegent as the other AIs in this sim it out to be interesting to watch!
Well, I took a shot at it, again with the sometimes-maybe-it depends. Worked in one direction, but not the other, doesn't always work, SOS. I think for now I'm gonna quit and go with the less-than-perfect setup I have, work on PO&N5 for a while to get the taste of defeat out of my mouth before I tackle it again.
I guess I can live with the occasional glitch for the next version, I'm gonna simplify the AI routes for one-way only traffic, and finish and release version 5 with signals and AI trafffic that works most of the time. I haven't achieved perfection on any other aspect of the PO&N yet, so why I was worried about this I dunno.
At the moment, we stand at the 4 signal rule, and the trick for balance is to have the 3 on the AI track spaced the right distance beyond the junction to give the player sufficient warning of the approach without making him wait 10 minutes for the traffic to arrive and pass. I think I can do this with what got, altho I'm gonna try the expected player performance thingamy to adjust the speed of the AI trains. The answer to the original question seems to be, No. There is no way to directly set and adjust the speed of AI traffic. Like everything else about these godforsaken editors, you got to go at it from an oblique angle. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
rgarber (840 posts)
Dec-14-01, 09:28 PM (EST) 4. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" I didn't think it would give you a total solution but I thought it might help some.Rich Garber Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (1074 posts)
Dec-15-01, 00:55 AM (EST) 6. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" LAST EDITED ON Dec-15-01 AT 00:56 AM (EST)OK, I just checked out what the guy said about hacking the sig ahead value. It's not really a 3 signal rule, tho, as you pointed out before it's 4. Green, flashing yellow, steady yellow, red. Altho that is 3 if you don't count the green, and the rule is how many need to be between you and the red? That would mean you would count the green and not count the red tho.
We need Abbott and Costello to do a routine for this, especially when it comes to signals at the end of the line and entrance to yard ladders.Jim: Why is the signal flashing yellow instead of green?
Rich: Because the one beyond it is yellow.
Jim: OK, why is that one yellow?
Rich: Because the one beyond that is not green.
Jim: All I wanna know is, What's the name of the guy on first!
Rich: Who's on first. Anyway, I'm gonna try hacking the min number, got nothing to lose. I tried the expected performance thing, dropping both player and AI to 25, seems to make the AI train run at a more realistic speed, altho I had to do it several times cuz it kept resetting itself to the default after I saved it. Maybe that "compute and save" is necessary to make it stick. Still gotta space out the intervals just right to get enough seconds warning time.Check out this one;
http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID3/4850.html Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
TOPDOG5184 (159 posts)
Dec-15-01, 01:17 AM (EST) 7. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" Hiya Rich. Hi Jim. A guy told me a few days ago how to adjust your starting speed to actually get your train to start at the speed you want. now even though this is for the player train it may work on the AI trains. He told me to go into the activity file and adjust it manually and not in the activity editor. now I haven't tested the theory I'm going to suggest to you because frankly I stink at these editors and I've been at it since june and haven't even created a 5 mile long route yet. try going into the activity file in the activities folder of the P.O.&N. version5 and open the activity folder and open the activity you want to fix the AI train with wordpad (notepad in win. XP) which I'm sure you know by now seeing as you've opened the signal files. now find the AI speed and try adjusting it manually. see if that works. Hope it does cause then maybe I can get these dumb AI's to stop running the reds and ramming me head on at full speed of 120 in an 80 zone. didn't they ever hear of brakes? Craig Shortino AI= Absent Intellegence ( umm not sure if thats spelled right) Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
rgarber (840 posts)
Dec-15-01, 09:21 AM (EST) 8. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" Gotta to do two responses here... First of it, it is three. Not four. I've done this too many times now. I know about the four different color aspects, but to get your ai train to work with the player train, for a meet that is, it's three.Second, I've done it both ways. No I don't mean that... I mean adjusting the starting and stopping speed. In the activity editor set both speeds the same and then save. It should take then. It's fidgety though. You should be able to alter it after that.On player expected performance. In my book I stated I don't mess with this setting because its been debated here in this forum before that it may alter a few other elements in the game. This is why I've never tried it so I can't say what I've seen or not with it. The way I approached with the Activity Editor was to keep the variables of confusion limited to what I could test out before I altered anything else. I did see an activity done with the player performance level downgraded. The train was doing some switching chores in Smallville's yard. I sat at the Smallville station fascinated watching this thing do it's job. It also turned out later that this was an RS2 with that engine problem I talked to you all about before in our other thread. I haven't redone the activity since after the engine file was fixed. But it was cool to watch.Rich Garber Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (1074 posts)
Dec-16-01, 02:01 AM (EST) 9. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" TopDog, you're supposed to be fixing the front coupler bug, not playing with AI trains. That's why they keep running you over, the Artificial Stupidity is telling you to get back to work. You actually manage to do that without making it feel unrealistic, you're gonna make all those physics geniuses look like a bunch of dopes, so get cracking.Yeah, Rich, I know Who's on first now, I just wanna know What's the name of the guy on second.
However you look at it, the distance ahead of the AI train that the path is projected is a certain number of signals, it triggers the interlockings to wake up, and sets...all the switches between the last signal in the sequence and the next one coming up?...for it's path. So the speed is critical, the spacing between signals is critical, and the two are tied together so that the speed, at least when the AI train is approaching a junction with the player path, has to be consistent. If there's no way to regulate it seperately I'll probably have to go back to wait points, I found that reducing the player and the AI perfomance from 75 to 25 slows down the AI trains to more realistic speeds, but it would be nice to reduce the amount of time the player has to wait for the AI train at a meet while still giving him enough warning to stop short of the switch. Some kind of distance signal would work for that, I noticed Dick Van de Hoven was talking about something like that for euro routes, possibly there might be a USA thing in the works. Conn and Hank made some pretty searchlight signals, but the ones from Marias have the old-fashioned look I need, so I want to stay with that look at least. BTW, what's with the missing extended shape for the gantry signals? I noticed you have some on your route, and they're also on Marias, but trying to place one gives a no extended shape data, failed to find \global\textures\WTF. Look for the file in \global\textures and there it is, but I suppose the fact that the editor can't find it shouldn't be a surprise by now. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
TOPDOG5184 (159 posts)
Dec-16-01, 02:41 AM (EST) 10. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" LAST EDITED ON Dec-16-01 AT 02:43 AM (EST)Hi Sniper. I got that info before I started on the coupler fix. I needed a break yesterday so I just read a few posts. thought I could help. the coupler is coming along but very very slowly. its not that easy for a 17 year old with no experience with hacking files until MSTS came around. I have enough experience for this though as I've been hacking these files since I got MSTS in june so I'm gettin better at it but I learn something new with these files everyday. Good Luck with the AI. you and I are somewhat alike though. We're both treading in uncharted waters and like you I like getting my feet wet. Craig Shortino Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (1074 posts)
Dec-16-01, 12:28 PM (EST) 11. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" Uncharted waters is right, with rocks and shoals and a busted fathometer to boot. If you're only 17 that's perfect tho, still young enough to have the "Damn the torpedoes, full steam ahead!" attitude, so you might make it. Or go out in a blaze of glory with your keel ripped out. You're still the only one trying it tho, so just in case you run aground you may want to think about posting some of your soundings if you want someone to follow you in and tow you off the reef. I've been hacking programs since 1978, but I looked at the eng files and don't see anything at all that distinguishes between front & rear couplers, so I don't even have a clue where you might be headed.
Back to the AI, I have a test activity set up with 5 different AI trains, they seem to be doing about 20 mph or so with the performance set to 25, now I gotta try mixing that greased -lightning GP-38x17 mixed with the turtle 2xGP38x35 mixed and see if I can get them to run at the same speed. Or fool around with wait points again, I'm looking at that send/don't send screen more often when I play around with wait points and temp speed zones tho. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
BFree (4 posts)
Dec-16-01, 04:06 PM (EST) 12. "RE: Controlling AI traffic train speed" Forget the waiting points. I agree with Whistle: they are for player services only and it´s just coïncidence that they work a little bit for traffic.Pim Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

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