I am humbly seeking advice

This is kind of Train Sim related and I could use some input on this.
I'm in the planning stages of building a new computer, in hopes of seeing the sim in as much glory as I can muster. Before I can start getting prices and such, I have one decision to make. Which processor to go with: AMD or Pentium?
My limited understanding is that AMD is faster, but runs hotter, requiring more cooling, and they're cheaper (not that money is the issue).
Any more info would be greatly appreciated.
HawkIt's the "Orange Blossom Special" bringing my baby home.

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RE: I am humbly seeking advice., IcyFire, Dec-23-02, 04:26 PM, (1) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., DTA, Dec-23-02, 05:02 PM, (2) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., chazlee1, Dec-23-02, 05:38 PM, (3) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., derekmorton, Dec-23-02, 05:48 PM, (4) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., Stumbl, Dec-23-02, 05:48 PM, (5) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., Hawk, Dec-23-02, 06:36 PM, (6) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., mttcrlsn, Dec-23-02, 08:47 PM, (9) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., bob hahn, Dec-24-02, 01:15 AM, (12) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., mttcrlsn, Dec-24-02, 02:42 PM, (15) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., edwardk, Dec-23-02, 07:54 PM, (7) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., mttcrlsn, Dec-23-02, 08:43 PM, (8) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., CWA13000, Dec-23-02, 10:49 PM, (10) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., LAHDPOP, Dec-23-02, 10:58 PM, (11) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., Stumbl, Dec-24-02, 09:53 AM, (13) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., Hawk, Dec-24-02, 10:28 AM, (14) RE: I am humbly seeking advice., mttcrlsn, Dec-24-02, 02:49 PM, (16)

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Hello Hawk, My personal opinion is That the AMD's are for the more savings conscious buyer, but a inferior chip, they Burn up should something to the heatsink (it could fall off, you never know, tomshardware did a movie on this) I personally Throw my weight behind the Pentiums, go for at least 2.66 Ghz, But as some of the AMD fans will now flame me, so be it, it's all a matter of opinion, they both have similar performance, it's just about bang for your buck, I myself am going with a pentium.BTW: http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID1/2964.html

Shawn "Icy-Fire" Kenselaar ShawnSSK@Yahoo.com

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LOL! I have an Athlon, but I think they are much of a muchness in terms of speed, so as long as you get the fastest, you can't go far wrong with either. A couple of FPS per sec will not make much difference. Get plenty of DDR ram, and a good graphics and sound setup and you can have fun.David

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LAST EDITED ON Dec-23-02 AT 05:39 PM (EST)

I am running with a Pentium 4, 512mb of DDR SDRAM, and a 56mb Intel Extreme graphics card and a 2.5 gb processor. Everything running great!
ChazHappy Rails!

Chaz

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Shawn,The XP series of chips have an internal diode for temp sensing, so don't burn up any more.I have a Athlon and a pentium, while the Athlon runs hotter I see no other difference.Buy as BIG as you can, 512Mb of ram and a GF4 4xxxDerek

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IMHO
I have had far fewer hardware conflicts with pentium than AMDnot that there were a huge amount... just a noticeable difference.
I'm gonna beat up the green eyed monster , since I can't upgrade yet

"I do what my Rice Krispies tell me to do"

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Thanks for your input.
I have a Geforce 4mx440,64mb card and a SB Audigy Gamer card that I plan on using.
I also have the new WD-7200, 80gb (with 8mb of cache) hard drive that I'll partition to 5gb and 75gb (5gb being "C" drive).
So far, it would seem like a matter of personal preference.
I'll see what I can dig up on the internet.
Again, thanks.
HawkIt's the "Orange Blossom Special" bringing my baby home.

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LAST EDITED ON Dec-23-02 AT 08:53 PM (EST)

5GB is WAY SMALL for the C: drive. Mine is at just over 12GB and that is without all the MSTS customizations (Of course I have Ghost Recon and Allied Assault loaded too.) I would say a 15-20GB C: drive would be a better idea.
OOOPPS.. One more suggestion - ditch the MX video card. Trust me if you run at 1024x768-32, maximum video setting and with FSAA / Anisotropic Filtering you will notice a difference of at least 10FPS or so more so when the route get more complex. Get a geForce4 4200 at minimum if you have to, they only run about $100 or so.

--
Matt, Network Specialist
Herrington (BNSF milepost 295)
La Crosse, Wisconsin

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5GB is WAY SMALL for the C: drive.You can't really say that without knowing what's on it. It's true that every installer that comes along wants to install on C:, but you don't have to let them. I never let apps install on C:. I keep that for the OS, and nothing else. After a year of collecting fur, my Win2000 install is just below 3G's, in a 5G partition. Why do I do that? So I can run DriveImage on my OS partition once a week, without it taking very long. I may crash tomorrow, or download the Update From Hell, but I can restore the OS partition exactly as it was, never more than a week old.There are other backup strategies where having the OS in its own partition would not be as important, but this one works for me and has gotten me out of a lot of jams, so I keep it.

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Well im my personal experiance at home and work installing programs to as second drive other than the default does not always work as exepected. True if the program was wrote correctly it work but sometime the shareware/freeware ones have parts of the code assuming that it is in the default location. As for imaging I do the same thing. Each to their own. I was just offer what I had run up again on my PC and about 1,500+ computers setup at various businesses.My PC at this moment in time:
XP Pro - Taking about 3GB
MSTS - about 6GB
Other Games - about 9GB
Misc progams like Office, Photoshop - about 4GB

--
Matt, Network Specialist
Herrington (BNSF milepost 295)
La Crosse, Wisconsin

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If money is not the issue than I would go with a Pentium along with a board using Intel's chipset. By going this route, you can avoid those little issues that AMD people tend to get.Edward K.

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Okay here are some of the questions I ask my clients.1. What is your budget? How much can you spent and how much do you think you will spend?2. What will you be running on it? Okay MSTS is one thing but will you be running trains, creating/repainting rolling stock or making routes?Once those basic questions are answered then we can move on to the next question. I assume by the statement building one you mean down to the screw level. (Please don't take this next part the wrong way but I don't know you.) Have you done this before? Do you know how to install Windows from the beginning (no operating system).Okay now that I am done with that here is what I would get if I was to build a new PC today.CPU - Pentium 4 2.8 or 3.06GHzMemory - At least 512MB, 1GB if can afford itHard Drive - One 80GB for the programs and a 100GB for the data & backups of MSTS downloads.CD-RW drive for sure (DVD too... maybe but nit a DVD-RW as they are just to shaky standard wise right now.)Video - nVidia Geforce4 (42/44/46) or ATI 9700 PRO Monitor 19" Flat screen at least (LCDs still too pricy at that size)Audio - Sound Blaster AudigyOS - Windows XP Pro (Home is too crippled for my in my opinion)
Well that should be a start. PS I hate AMD processors; they are good for budget PC but suck for reliability. And for all the naysayers on AMD I have stacks of business that will not use them in the business due too the proven, yes proven instability.

--
Matt, Network Specialist
Herrington (BNSF milepost 295)
La Crosse, Wisconsin

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I'm waiting for the brown uniformed Santa to bring my new MO BO. He brought my 512mb of DDR 433 today. I was thinking why can I not just swap my old for new, just turn it back on, configure the BIOS and play where I left off.

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I'll stay out of the Intel vs AMD debate, because as you can see, there are compelling arguments for both (I use AMD). But I WILL say this:
If you upgrade to a screaming fast processor, and leave that MX card in there, you're really selling yourself short. As said above, go with either a ATI 9700, or a G4 based Ti series card. With plenty of CPU power and ample memory, you'll find that the MX card will become the bottleneck of your system.Pop

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FWIW... ATI has a horrible reputation for supporting their cards (drivers)

"I do what my Rice Krispies tell me to do"

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Thank you all for your advice, tips and opinions. I certainly have a little to think about. I'll also be doing some reading at Tomshardware. Interesting site.
Matt-Thanks for your input, especially. No, I didn't take anything wrong in what you said. Your comments/questions were understandable.
I have installed OS's on blank hard drives. From Win3.0 up to Win98SE, so that's not a problem. I plan on running Win98SE on the new one when I build it. Still waiting for WinXP's bugs to get worked out. I have not built any systems from scratch, but I have torn apart computers and put them back together before, and surprisingly, most times they still work.
As far as money, I don't have unlimited funds, but I do have about $700.00 I can invest.
Again, I thank you all.
HawkIt's the "Orange Blossom Special" bringing my baby home.

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Both nVidia and ATI have had problems with support as far as drivers go. Back in the 2D days ATI was great (and still, just check out how many servers are build by Dell and Intel with the ATI video.) nVidia has alway had the lead in the 3D area since the TNT2 days but ATI has been gaining ground fast. So far I have not had much trouble with the 9700 series from ATI. It should be mentioned that nVidia does not make any cards only the GPU and design of a "bench design" Since the manufacturres of the cards follow this design the drivers from nVidia work too.

--
Matt, Network Specialist
Herrington (BNSF milepost 295)
La Crosse, Wisconsin

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