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jm1941 (166 posts)
Nov-30-01, 10:15 PM (EST) "More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day all,I posted this post some time back now, but since I would say some of you may have updated your cpu's and video cards, also some probably never saw this original post. So inviting you to try this in a matter of interest.
I kept the benchmark exactly the same again, for those who participated in this before can continue on.On this forum we often see, I get 20fps, or, I get 60fps, or I get........... 500fps.
First of all here I USED the Marias Pass track for a baseline or benchmark purposes.
Long time ago I did this setup exercise amongst some fellow simmers with MS Flight Sim 98 & FS2k.
I found that very interesting as with my last post, BASIC FRAME RATES.
It was an interesting exercise. Okay where does everyone take those frame rate readings from?
Of course at times from wherever they get the best reading.
So I thought I would run this by you as a benchmark test, yet again....
What I've done here is shown you my system setup, still the same nothing fantastic, only refers to just the BASIC frame rates using a DEFAULT setting as a benchmark in MSTS and using a default (MSTS) stationary train.My MS Train Sim is set to this for this test. DISPLAY.
1024 x 768 x 16 (Best Graphics) ADVANCED DISPLAY
Everything FULL on, EXCEPT (specular Lighting)
Terrain error Threshold (about 28 on the slider) Now select the following……..
ROUTES:
Marias Pass
ACTIVITIES:
USE EXPLORE ROUTE
Select : DASH 9
Consist: 2 x Dash 9, 20 intermodel.
Starting at: WEST CORAM. (in the dead end siding)
Season: SUMMER
Weather: CLEAR I used this for a base only, no other reason and it's easy to find in MSTS.
When the window opens with the 2 x Dash 9, 20 intermodel train appears, check your frames. (Shift + Z)

Please train NOT to be moving.
**************************************************************
My system is:
---------------------------
Intel Pentium III-850mhz running old Windows 98. (Do not worry about Hard drives)
AGP WinFast (Leadtek) 64Mb Geforce2 GTS Pro graphics card. (as out of box, no tweaking)Gigabyte 6BA AT-Baby (100mz) Motherboard.
256 SDRAM (100mz)
Nvidia Drivers : Detonator XP v21.83 Windows 95/98/Me.
DirectX 8.0a
15" Sony SfII monitor Key 1 (with 2 x Dash 9, 20 intermodel train at opening screen) 26fps
Key 2 (outside view) 24fps.
Key 3 (rear view) 20fps
Key 4 (camera view) 19fps
Key 6 (coupling view) 60fps.
SHIFT +1 (front view) 27fps.
----------------------------
Please be honest.
What did your frame rates show with this DEFAULT BENCHMARK setup.
Again this is just out of interest, nothing more. No correspondence entered into.The last time I ran this quite a few participated in this, and I thank you all who did, and the results were quite interesting. This time if your interested, as each user puts their system setup and Frame rates for each key in.
Copy them into Notepad or whatever you use (put them in an order of CPU size) and after awhile the results are VERY interesting for those interested in this sort of thing. Also it just may give you some idea for your next UPGRADE in the future.
PLEASE NOTE!.....
Do not take anyone's frame rates as that is what you WILL get, IF you upgraded to their system.
If all readings are honest it just may give you at least SOME idea. Again no correspondence entered into.
John.
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Table of Contents

Subject Author Message Date ID RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jfroth1 Dec-01-01 1 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES derekmorton Dec-01-01 2 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-01-01 4 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES derekmorton Dec-01-01 6 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES nailz Dec-01-01 3 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES nailz Dec-01-01 7 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-01-01 5 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES steady1 Dec-03-01 8 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES derekmorton Dec-04-01 9 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES edlight Dec-10-01 11 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Kwp Dec-05-01 10 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-10-01 14 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES henry3 Dec-10-01 12 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-10-01 13 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES henry3 Dec-12-01 17 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES netjohn Dec-11-01 15 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-11-01 16 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Xacto Dec-13-01 18 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Joshua_Hill Dec-15-01 19 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES dgauci Dec-16-01 20 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-16-01 21 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Baldwinbob Dec-16-01 22 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-16-01 23 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Baldwinbob Dec-17-01 24 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jstarkey Dec-18-01 25 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-18-01 26 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Lars Dec-18-01 27 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-19-01 31 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Lars Dec-19-01 32 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-19-01 35 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Lars Dec-20-01 39 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-21-01 40 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Mrscotti Dec-18-01 28 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES DKlemm Dec-18-01 29 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES chucksc Dec-19-01 30 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES chucksc Dec-27-01 44 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES chucksc Dec-27-01 45 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES ozinoz Dec-19-01 33 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-19-01 36 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES svante Dec-19-01 34 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Would71 Dec-19-01 37 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES AlabamaRailfan Dec-19-01 38 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-21-01 41 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES Lars Dec-21-01 42 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Dec-26-01 43 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES henry3 Dec-27-01 46 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES cr8250 Jan-06-02 47 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Jan-07-02 48 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES TAfan Jan-07-02 49 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Jan-07-02 50 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES ozinoz Jan-08-02 51 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES ecpfeifer Jan-16-02 52 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES ecpfeifer Jan-16-02 53 RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES jm1941 Jan-16-02 54

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jfroth1 (51 posts)
Dec-01-01, 01:49 AM (EST) 1. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hi John,
Another John here...
I participated in this before with you, I think it's a fine comparison you request!
Note to all on this board, that this is not a 'race' but a real-time capture of the frame rate to compare to the benchmark for John's database...The data on this thread will help you upgrade your pc...My system:AMD TBird 1000
512 M sdram (not rdram)
WIN98 SE
PNY NVidia GeForce3 TI200 64Meg Ram (upgraded from prior GeForce2 MX400, but as I found the GF3Ti is NOT faster(!) than the GeForce2 on MSTS! But smooooother with MSTS.)
PCChips MB (Far East, cost-effective MB.)Detonator 21.85 drivers downloaded from 3DGuru.com (22.xx series drivers do NOT allow the MSTS Loco or other sounds to work on my pc!! Go figure!)
I run MSTS with the FSAA switch: (thanks Spittler...)
"C:\Program Files\Microsoft Games\Train Simulator\train.exe" /fsaaAll other MSTS 'default' settings per jm1941's.
1: 23
2: 22
3: 18
4: 18
6: 52
Shift-1: 25Thanks, John, for the request for updating your database.
I've got LOTS more of MSTS (and other) locos and freight downloads and other 'stuff' on my harddrive which I know have slowed down my framerates.
But the GeForce3 Ti200 was definitely a worthwhile upgrade; it's quite Smooooooooooooth on all my programs.
Cordially,
jfroth1
p.s. Did I say the GeForce3 Ti200 is SMoooooooooooooooooth?
jfr
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derekmorton (272 posts)
Dec-01-01, 02:19 AM (EST) 2. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Display 1280 x 1024 x 16 (best graphics)Advanced display
everything full on except specular lighting
Terrain error threshold 28route as per originalAthlon XP 1800+
GF3 Ti 200
GigaByte 7DXR
512Mb DDR 2100
21.83 drivers
DX8.0a1. 30
2. 20
3. 20
4. 20
6. 57
S1 30 Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-01-01, 10:44 PM (EST) 4. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day derekmorton,
Thanks for participating in this exercise and sorry to trouble you.
Could you change your DISPLAY setting of 1280 x 1024 x 16 (best graphics) TO The Benchmark DISPLAY: 1024 x 768 x 16 (Best Graphics) and re-post your frame rates.
This would be much appreciated.
With your higher 1280 display, is impossible to compare with other readings.
Be interesting to see what you get with that Athlon XP 1800+
Haven't had a reading with a CPU up in that bracket.
Thanks.John Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
derekmorton (272 posts)
Dec-01-01, 11:16 PM (EST) 6. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" >Display 1280 x 1024 x 16
>(best graphics)
>
>Advanced display
>everything full on except specular lighting
>
>Terrain error threshold 28
>
>route as per original
>
>Athlon XP 1800+
>GF3 Ti 200
>GigaByte 7DXR
>512Mb DDR 2100
>21.83 drivers
>DX8.0a
> 1280 1024x768
>1. 30 30
>2. 20 30
>3. 20 30
>4. 20 22
>6. 57 57
>S1 30 30
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nailz (3 posts)
Dec-01-01, 08:27 PM (EST) 3. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" My computer is a IBM Aptiva, P.O.S!!! 449Mhz thing with no specific graphics card, i think it's intergrated or somethingrunning at 640x480832 Max for the computer
i get1. 3
2. 2
3. 2
4. 2
6. 4
shift 1. 3time for an upgrade i think, P4 or AMD 1800++Nail Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
nailz (3 posts)
Dec-01-01, 11:42 PM (EST) 7. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" sorry, thats 640x480x32, and thats the best our somputer does Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-01-01, 10:49 PM (EST) 5. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day all,Could you all please set your DISPLAYS to 1024 x 768 x 16 (Best Graphics) before doing your frame rate test.
This is to keep the BENCHMARK or BASELINE on an even keel.Thanks all,
John. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
steady1 (10 posts)
Dec-03-01, 09:55 PM (EST) 8. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" My test results using your benchmark setting exactly, on Celeron 700mhz cpu, 392meg ram, Nvidia TNT2 M64 64meg video card.1 3 - 7 fps (variable min - max readings )
2 4 - 6 fps ( ditto )
3 5 (stable)
4 5 (stable)
6 16 -18 fps
shift-1 7 fpsThis game seems to be pushing the limit on the machine as when a train is running the frame rate drops beiefly to 1 or even 0 every now and then.My sons PC P111 600mhz, 512 meg ram, GeForce 11 64 meg video card1 12 fps
2 18 fps
3 18 fps
4 20 fps
6 22 fps
shift-1 22 fpsUnfortunately access to my sons machine is restricted to authorised personnel only, and temporary passes receive low priority access.Peter
2
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derekmorton (272 posts)
Dec-04-01, 02:23 AM (EST) 9. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" It is not your machine that is lacking, only your video card.Derek EngMod@leder.com.au>This game seems to be pushing the limit on the machine
>as when a train is running the frame rate drops
>beiefly to 1 or even 0 every now and then.
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edlight (59 posts)
Dec-10-01, 08:48 AM (EST) 11. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Here's a cheap fix for that Celeron, I think it's faster than a geforce 200 mx, $42 postpaid from compuvest.com, search for geforce256 (one word).HERCULES NVIDIA GEFORCE256 32MB AGP
$36I have one on a 700 Duron. Not yet experienced enough to do the benchmark for you. In the Marias introductory ride I push 3 as it starts and get 15, then 21 near the bridge, in SVGA.Be sure to download the latest drivers from nvidia if you get one. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Kwp (13 posts)
Dec-05-01, 07:57 PM (EST) 10. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hi,
Here are my specs.& framerates for your database.
All game settings & resolution as requested.Intell PIII 733MHz
128 Mb system ram
Not sure about the mainboard. Computer is a Compaq Deskpro,
( package deal )
Windows 98
Voodoo 4 4500, 32Mb ram.(requested at time of purchase) Driver, 3DFX16VS.drvShift+key 1 16 fps
key 1 15/16 fps
key 2 14 fps
key 3 11/12 fps
key 4 11 fps
key 6 38 fpsI don`t usually run with the detail as high as this, maybe if I can get a 64 or even a (sigh)128 Mb card ...you listening,Santa?BTW my sound sliders are set to max. (for the ESE)
Does sound quality affect framerates?Keep`em runnin`
Keith.
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jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-10-01, 05:09 PM (EST) 14. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Keith,Thanks for your settings for my database is much appreciated.
Nicely put. Your frames for that CPU and card your using, that's about right with other comparisons..........Aussie John
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henry3 (476 posts)
Dec-10-01, 03:18 PM (EST) 12. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" I think you'll find this interesting....My system is:
---------------------------
AMD 1.4 Ghz running old Windows 98.
Leadtek WinFast 64Mb Geforce 2MX SH-MAX graphics card. (as out of box, no tweaking)Soyo Dragon 7 Motherboard.
512 MB DDRAM
Nvidia Drivers : Detonator XP v21.83 Windows 95/98/Me.
DirectX 8.0a
19" Viewsonic A90 monitor Result: Froze upon loading, would not run!!Now I have had this card running before, but it rarely supported anything higher than 800x600, 32-bit and would tend to deteriorate over time.I thought that I had a fairly powerful system, particularly the video card, but now I'm thinking that either the video card is flawed or not as good as I had hoped. Or that the combination that I'm running just doesn't like the game.I haven't seen anything in the old messages regarding this set-up, so I figued I'd post it in this thread. Does anybody have any ideas on this before I yank out this @&$*!! video card?Henry Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-10-01, 04:59 PM (EST) 13. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Henry,Well I cannot thank you for your settings for obvious reasons, I feel for you mate, but if I was you I would yank what you call "that @&$*!! video card" out (not Windfast's fault) take it back and exchange it for a 64meg Leadtek (Windfast) Geforce 2 GTS/Pro, or the Geforce3 that is if your rich, or if you can find one that fell of the back of a truck, but the Geforce2 GTS would the least you should be using with that CPU. The MX's is another story, please no correspondence entered into on MX's please.See my original post settings that you answered here to see my pathetic setup that goes great with MSTS, and did not cost me an arm and a leg. I only have a PIII-850 (100mz) but whether its an AMD or PIII or 4 is up to individuals, my preference is just Intel. Again no correspondence entered into on cpu's please.Plus I see your got a 19" monitor, you will need the 64meg one if your going to use the higher resolutions. 32megs is okay for say up to 1024 x 768, but your starting pushing the envelope a wee bit over that. I installed a 64, not because I use anything higher than 1024x768 on my old Sony 15", but later when I upgrade to a 17" or a 19" monitor I think I will be glad I got the 64meg one. It was only extra $40 Aus, saves getting another card later. Being retired these days and a bit strapped for cash. I think the clue is what you said here, and you answered your own question.
> Now I have had this card running before,
> but it rarely supported anything higher than 800x600,
> 32-bit and would tend to deteriorate over time.Hope I helped here.Aussie John
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henry3 (476 posts)
Dec-12-01, 12:03 PM (EST) 17. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day John,Yes, you helped me out quite a bit by just confirming the suspicion that I've had for some time. Alas, I think the old card is too old to exchange, (that's the reward I get for messing with it for so long!) but maybe I can find a good home for it. (Other than the rubbish bin. )I'll be off to the stores this weekend for a look around. When I get back up and running, I should have some stats for you.Thanks again!Henry Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
netjohn (1 posts)
Dec-11-01, 11:54 AM (EST) 15. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Ciao from ItalyMy system is:Pentium4 1.9Ghz
1GB Ram
Geforce3 Ti500 (Detonator v23.11)
Windows XP (pro) DirectX 8.1
Sony 20SE2 (very old but excellent monitor)MSTS
Display 1024 x 768 x 16 and everythig else as your request.
Results:
1. 33
2. 31
3. 25
4. 23
6. 60
S1. 34Michele Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-11-01, 03:41 PM (EST) 16. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Michele,Thanks kindly for your settings, IS very much appreciated.
Biggest CPU so far.
Get a better idea with a few more readings on the higher end CPU's and cards. It's all very interesting..........Aussie John
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Xacto (629 posts)
Dec-13-01, 09:54 AM (EST) 18. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" AthlonXP 1.47 (1700+ as they like to call it)
MSI K7T266 Pro2
Gainward GF3 64M w/ 21.83 drivers
512M RAM
Windows 98
All settings as specified originallyKey 1: 45 fps
Key 2: 35 fps
Key 3: 35 fps
Key 4: 34 fps
Key 6: 58 fps
Shift +1: 48 fpsI upgraded from a P2 450, so this has been fun Cliff Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Joshua_Hill (90 posts)
Dec-15-01, 10:46 AM (EST) 19. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" My current system:
AMD Athlon 600 MHz running Windows 98
AGP 3dfx Voodoo3 3500tv (16 MB)
MSI 6167 mainboard
256 MB sdram (100 MHz)
Already old but not designed for the 3500tv... Voodoo3 2000/3000 DirectX 8 drivers... 4.12.01.0638 (released 29-nov-2000)Key 1: 18 fps
Key 2: 14 fps
Key 3: 12 fps
Key 4: 14 fps
Key 6: 37 fps
SHIFT+1: 18 fpsI'm curious what it's gonna be with the new GeForce2 Ti card I just bought Josh /=\ Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
dgauci (367 posts)
Dec-16-01, 00:34 AM (EST) 20. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" 1024x768x16
Everything per instructionsMy system is:
---------------------------
Intel Pentium III-1ghz (100mhz)
Windows XP Pro
AGP PNY Verto Geforce2 MX400 64mb (as out of box, no tweaking)Dell Dimension XPS T600
768mb SDRAM (100mz)
Nvidia Drivers : Detonator XP v23.11 Windows XP/2000.
DirectX 8.1
19" Dell P990 (Sony Trinitron) monitor Key 1 24fps
Key 2 21fps
Key 3 19fps
Key 4 18fps
Key 6 41fps
SHIFT +1 25fps
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jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-16-01, 02:49 PM (EST) 21. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day dgauci,Thanks for doing this for me, it is much appreciated.
-----------------
While I'm here, thanks to all of you who have put their settings here as well.
Anyone else, please add yours here as well, no matter how big or small your computer is. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Baldwinbob (15 posts)
Dec-16-01, 07:40 PM (EST) 22. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hello JohnDell 8200 Pentium 4 @ 1.9 GHz
Windows XP
512MB PC800 RDRAM
64MB DDR NVIDIA GeForce3 4X AGP with DVI
19" P991 FD Trinitron MonitorFrame rates: 1024 x 768 x 16 Best Graphics

1 key 37-38
2 36
3 29
4 27
6 56 {side view}
Sft+1 38
Crank up the Altec Lansing Surround Sound 5.1 speakers with Rich's SW1200 the floor shakes and the dog runs for the bedroom.Bob Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-16-01, 11:30 PM (EST) 23. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Bob,Thanks for your settings.> Crank up the Altec Lansing Surround Sound 5.1 speakers
> with Rich's SW1200 the floor shakes and the dog runs for the bedroom.Wow! that sounds great for these modern times Bob.
But nothing beats sitting in hot seat in the late 60's of a Beyer Garratt 4-8-2 + 2-8-4 heading up the Belalie North Bank in Sth Aus double heading full load. ROAR,,,,, no one knows what roaring is, till one gets in the cab of one of these beautys. You would never see the dog or cat ever again. What did you say Bob, bit hard of hearing these days. He he, but it was nice though. :>
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Baldwinbob (15 posts)
Dec-17-01, 08:31 PM (EST) 24. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Back in the late 50's my dad was a dock foreman for DM&IR RR in Duluth, Minnesota. He would bring us to the crossing to watch the steamers chug-a-lug up the hill to Proctor, 1.5 or 2 % I would guess. Don't know what breed they were, I was only 5 or 6 years old at the time. But I do know they were big, black and noisy as hell. Sure wish I was in the "hot seat".Merry Christmas from northern Minnesota!Bob Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jstarkey (20 posts)
Dec-18-01, 01:26 AM (EST) 25. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" John,Very interesting to compare my results to the others. Here's my system:*Compaq Presario
*1.0 GHz AMD Athalon Processor
*256 RAM
*Nvidia Graphics Processor 64 MB (Updated drivers to ver. 21.83)
*Compaq generic 19" monitorKey 1 = 30fps
Key 2 = 30fps
Key 3 = 26fps
Key 4 = 24fps
Key 6 = 55fps
SHIFT+1 = 34fpsI'm the guy that was complaining about poor graphics when in areas with lots of buildings, wavy tracks and jerky train movements. The thing is , from what I can see here, my system compares favorably with others. I double checked my results and followed your instructions carefully. What gives? If my system is running so well, how come I still have such poor (IMHO) graphics? This is my first sim game experience and I don't have anything to compare to MSTS, but it seems to me it could look a heck of a lot better....Any suggestions? Am I just expecting too much of MSTS?Thanks,James Starkey Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-18-01, 05:55 AM (EST) 26. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Bob, That is something you do not see these days.
Dad bringing the kids to look and wave at the trains going past, or the kids running out and waving madly. That USE to give most crews a great lift. My times sure have changed.> But I do know they were big, black and noisy as hell. YES… big, black and noisy …. but the nicest noisy there possibly is. I have a Garratt sound file on the desktop, one click, turn up the volume and I go back 35 years instantly. Ah yes……Bob, have a good one. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Lars (13 posts)
Dec-18-01, 09:58 AM (EST) 27. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" LAST EDITED ON Dec-18-01 AT 10:02 AM (EST)Hi again. I was just looking for the "old" thread in the MSTS forum, as I have been away from this forum for a while. I have been playing FS2002 a LOT lately. However I noticed the posted results on the P4 1.9 Ghz and realized it must have sdram. Just to give you an idea that a P4 can actually perform really well in other games than Quake 3 I'd like to share my results. With the suggested settings I get the following results:View 1: 51 fps, Shift +1: 53 fps
View 2: 49 fps
View 3: 40 fps
View 4: 39 fps
View 5: N/A
View 6: 59 fpsSystem specs are: Abit TH7-II raid, Intel P4 1.5 @ 2.0 Ghz (533/133 Mhz fsb), 512 MB RDRAM at PC1066 specs, Creative GF3 @ 240/530 Mhz (21.81 drivers), win98se Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-19-01, 00:37 AM (EST) 31. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Lars,Thanks for your latest settings.
Bit of a query here.
You replaced your PIII - 1 gig with a P4 - 1.7 gig
Your latest post show a P4 - 1.5 gig
Below is what I have recorded.
What was actually changed this time.
I presume I have same LARS person. LARS.
PIII - 1 gig (150 Mhz fsb)
Creative Geforce3 @ 240/510 Mhz,
Asus P3B-F
Key 1 = 35 fps
Key 2 = 33 fps
Key 3 = 27 fps
Key 4 = 27 fps
Key 6 = 58 fps
Shift+1 = ?LARS replaced with a P4 1.7gig cpu
P4 - 1.7Ghz
Creative Geforce3 @ 240/510 Mhz
Abit TH7-II Raid,
Key 1 = 47 fps
Key 2 = 44 fps
Key 3 = 37 fps
Key 4 = 37 fps
Key 6 = 60 fps
Shift+1 = 49 fps LARS with another post…Dec18-01
Intel P4 1.5 @ 2.0 Ghz (533/133 Mhz fsb)
Creative GF3 @ 240/530 Mhz (21.81 drivers)
Abit TH7-II raid
512 MB RDRAM at PC1066 specs
Win98se
Key 1 = 51 fps
Key 2 = 49 fps
Key 3 = 40 fps
Key 4 = 39 fps
Key 6 = 59 fps
Shift+1= 53 fps
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Lars (13 posts)
Dec-19-01, 02:44 AM (EST) 32. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" >G'day Lars,
>
>Thanks for your latest settings.
>Bit of a query here.
>You replaced your PIII - 1
>gig with a P4 -
>1.7 gig
>Your latest post show a P4
>- 1.5 gig
>Below is what I have recorded.
>
>What was actually changed this time.
>
>I presume I have same LARS
>person. Yup, it's me indeed. The thing is I was one of a few very lucky winners of a P4 cpu in the Abit P4 giveaway competition. So I won a P4 1.5 Ghz cpu. Tried it out and found that performance was much better at ~2 Ghz with the 1.5 because of the higer fsb speed. Also the release bios of the TH7-II was a bit quirky when overclocking, and the 1.5 allowed me to overclock the cpu/ram, and keep everything else in spec, i.e. agp/pci speed, which also allowed me to push the ram on the GF3 a bit further without any artifacts. It was a "no-brainer", so I sold my 1.7 Ghz cpu and kept the 1.5 Ghz. My plan is to upgrade to a Northwood sometime in april/may anyway. That's what happened Lars Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-19-01, 04:07 PM (EST) 35. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Lars,>> So I won a P4 1.5 Ghz cpu,Some have all the luck.
I'm afraid my old PIII-850 (100mz) and GF2 GTS will have to keep blasting away for next 12 months or so. Of course that is IF I can win "Lotto" Fat chance...and pigs will learn to fly too...Later on I will put all the frame rate settings I have collected here in the General Forum.
Been figuring best way to do it, but like to get a few more settings first. It's quite interesting. Of course in all this we are relying on honesty here.
I tried to find my old "BASIC FRAME RATES" posts, but no go.
When on the Forum they get too old, they must drop them off.
I had the page saved, BUT you know what happens when we get er energetic and have hard drive clean-ups. Do I really need that file, Naaaaa, got the basics copied elsewhere anyway.... DELETE..... and later on you forgot to copy other bits which at the time seemed un-important.Well, we Win some (you do) and we loose some (I do) Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Lars (13 posts)
Dec-20-01, 02:52 AM (EST) 39. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" >I can win "Lotto"
>Fat chance...and pigs will learn
>to fly too... I know how you feel. I've never won anything in my life before, and I was so sure I wouldn't this time either. See I heard about the competition before I bought my new motherboard (that was a requirement for entry). The competition went on for 5 weeks, winners were drawn every week. I had forgotten to read the serialnumber (on the backside of the motherboard) before I installed it, and decided it wasn't worth it taking it out to enter a contest a had zero chances of winning After about 4 weeks of overclocking I knew it was time to get a bigger case, so I ordered one. It arrived on the very last day of the competition, so as I was moving my system into the new case, I wrote down the number and entered the competition. About a week later, when I received an email from Abit marketing, I can assure you my jaw dropped, and it REALLY made my day.>Later on I will put all
>the frame rate settings I
>have collected here in the
>General Forum. Great idea.>Been figuring best way to do
>it, but like to get
>a few more settings first.
>It's quite interesting. Of course
>in all this we are
>relying on honesty here.
>I tried to find my old
>"BASIC FRAME RATES" posts, but
>no go.
>When on the Forum they get
>too old, they must drop
>them off. You have to tick the little box on the bottom of the search page called "Also search the archived threads?" Then you'll find this: <http://www.train-sim.com/cgi/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?az=show_thread&om=3137&forum=DCForumID3&archive=yes> You see, I couldn't find it either, at first
Best regardsLars Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-21-01, 04:41 AM (EST) 40. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Lars,
I put an answer to you at bottom of the thread, so others will see what I put in it as well. Here we are a bit far up the thread, if others open this post first time.John. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Mrscotti (39 posts)
Dec-18-01, 07:23 PM (EST) 28. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Went out and got a new motherboard and proccessor, Here are the results:P4 1.7 Ghz (Intel)
D850GB MoBo (intel)400mhz bus
256mb ram pc800 RIMMVisiontek GE Force2mx400 64MB
w/12.01 drivers only1024x768x16
1-33
2-25
3-20
4-25
6-50
Shift1-25What I usually run MSTS in is 1280x1024x161-21
2-17
3-14
4-17
6-43
Shift1-17MSTS sure looks a lot better to me now. The old Gateway MoBo and p3 650 just didn't cut it for me, your mileage may vary Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
DKlemm (995 posts)
Dec-18-01, 10:14 PM (EST) 29. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" These numbers were taken when I didn't shut anything extra down like my firewall or virus protection or TSR stuff.P4 1.5g
384 ram rambus
nvidia GeForce 2 32 meg
Windows ME1:21
2:21
3:15
4:17
6:28
shift-1:17David Klemm
Illinois Central Route
Illinois and St Louis Divisions
Ver 0.6 uploaded
Working on Decatur IL
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chucksc (738 posts)
Dec-19-01, 00:20 AM (EST) 30. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hi there,
System Specs are an AMD "C-Bird" 1.4ghz on an IWILL KK266 mobo, 1024mb of Ram and the Video Card is a GeForce2/mx with 32mb of video ram.... OS is WIndows/XP-HomeView 1: 30 fps, Shift +1: 46 fps
View 2: 24 fps
View 3: 20 fps
View 4: 24 fps
View 5: N/A
View 6: 59 fps
------Chuck Schneider---------

-----"Power for You"------- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
chucksc (738 posts)
Dec-27-01, 01:52 AM (EST) 44. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" And Santa Claus updated the video card to a GeForce 3/ti200 (w/64mb of video memnory) and all other specs remained the same...View 1: 34 fps
Shift 1: 36 fps
View 2: 30 fps
View 3: 27 fps
View 4: 24 fps
View 5: n/a
View 6: 60 fpsA decent Increase, However it still skips occasionally. Albeit less often and less noticable...>Hi there,
>System Specs are an AMD "C-Bird"
>1.4ghz on an IWILL KK266
>mobo, 1024mb of Ram and
>the Video Card is a
>GeForce2/mx with 32mb of video
>ram.... OS is WIndows/XP-Home
>
>View 1: 30 fps, Shift +1:
>46 fps
>View 2: 24 fps
>View 3: 20 fps
>View 4: 24 fps
>View 5: N/A
>View 6: 59 fps
>
>
------Chuck Schneider---------

-----"Power for You"------- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
chucksc (738 posts)
Dec-27-01, 09:38 AM (EST) 45. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" $hit! I did this last update in 32bit! I'll have to redo it and repost it.....
>And Santa Claus updated the video
>card to a GeForce 3/ti200
>(w/64mb of video memnory) and
>all other specs remained the
>same...
>
>View 1: 34 fps
>Shift 1: 36 fps
>View 2: 30 fps
>View 3: 27 fps
>View 4: 24 fps
>View 5: n/a
>View 6: 60 fps
>
>A decent Increase, However it still
>skips occasionally. Albeit less often
>and less noticable...
>
>>Hi there,
>>System Specs are an AMD "C-Bird"
>>1.4ghz on an IWILL KK266
>>mobo, 1024mb of Ram and
>>the Video Card is a
>>GeForce2/mx with 32mb of video
>>ram.... OS is WIndows/XP-Home
>>
>>View 1: 30 fps, Shift +1:
>>46 fps
>>View 2: 24 fps
>>View 3: 20 fps
>>View 4: 24 fps
>>View 5: N/A
>>View 6: 59 fps
>>
>>
>
>
>------Chuck Schneider---------
>
>-----"Power for You"-------
------Chuck Schneider---------

-----"Power for You"------- Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
ozinoz (121 posts)
Dec-19-01, 03:41 AM (EST) 33. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Not very encouraging...Celeron 800, 512 meg Sdram. MSI M/B (no idea of model) GeForce2 400 MX 32 meg card. Win XP Home, with Detonator 23.11 Drivers and Direct X 8.1
key 1 13 fps
key 2 8 fps
key 3 16 fps
key 4 8 fps
Key 6 20 fps
Shift 1 14 fpsSetting as per bench markpretty average...I thought it might have been a little better than this...Cheers,OZ
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jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-19-01, 04:35 PM (EST) 36. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day OZ,Do not be too disappointed, actually your doing well for a CELERON 800.
Now if you had a PIII-800 or AMD-800 the story would be a bit different. The Celerons do not have the architecture needed like the PIII & AMD's have. Look on a Celeron as a cut down version of the P3's. That's it really in a nutshell. I've heard yarns how the higher Celerons are equal to the equivalent P3's, but boy you wont convince me on that one without me actually seeing it. But of course also the extra frames you would get, would not be all that mind blowing either, just marginally better. With low frames even a few extra frames is better, but it all comes AT A COST.... like everything in life.
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svante (409 posts)
Dec-19-01, 10:23 AM (EST) 34. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Athlon 900 MHz
764 MB RAM
GeForce 2 GTS 32 MB1: 24
2: 23
3: 19
4: 19
6: 57
Shift+1: 26 Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Would71 (118 posts)
Dec-19-01, 07:03 PM (EST) 37. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" AMD Duron/1000 @ 1266 (133x9.5) Morgan core w/ SSE, enh. TLB, etc.
EPoX 8K7A m/b, rev. 1.0, latest official BIOS
512 MB Crucial CAS 2.5 (@ CAS 2) PC2100 DDR.. 2 x 256 MB DIMMs
ATi Radeon VIVO SE.. 198/198 def. core/mem, O/C to 261/229.5 (459 DDR) core/mem
DX 8.1 final, Win98SE
modified ATi drivers, combination of 7199 set for Win98SE and the Radeon 8500 drivers
Seagate Barracuda IV 80 GB
etc. etc. etc.Tested in both 16 and 32 bit color modes.. both gave identical numbers. (typical ATi)Key 1: 37
Key 2: 36
Key 3: 30
Key 4: 29
Key 6: 57
Shift-1: 40 Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
AlabamaRailfan (93 posts)
Dec-19-01, 11:05 PM (EST) 38. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hey Guys,
Thought I would throw my .02 in!Here are my numbers:
1. 32 fps
2. 30 fps
3. 28 fps
4. 27 fps
6. 32 fps
Shift 1. 32 fpsHere is my system for those that are interested:Asus A7V-266E Mobo
AMD Palomino XP 1500+ (1.34Ghz) proc
256MB DDR RAM
Two Maxtor 30GB ATA100 drives in RAID 0 config
VisionTek GeForce 2 Titanium w/64MB DDR video RAM
Windows XP Professional
nVidia Detonator XP drivers v23.11I did have a PIII 600Mhz with 512MB of PC133 RAM and the same video card and drivers and it wouldn't touch those numbers. I built this system myself from parts I bought and I have been quite happy with the results so far. It is only a couple weeks old.Happy Simming!John D. Peterson
Webmaster - AlabamaRailfan.com
http://www.alabamarailfan.com
MSTS Section: http://www.alabamarailfan.com/msts/
john@alabamarailfan.com
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jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-21-01, 04:49 AM (EST) 41. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Lars,THANKS, THANKS, THANKS, Your a life saver.
Buggered if I could find "Just BASIC FRAME RATES" but with your address here it was a piece of cake.
<http://www.train-sim.com/cgi/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?az=show_thread&om=3137&forum=DCForumID3&archive=yes>; On your 1.5gig CPU I've entered it as "hotted up" to show that to have a basic system like yours and run it normally they cannot expect these sort of frames. Hope you understand.
My aim is to try and keep it as a BENCHMARK or Baseline with CPU and VIDEO CARD as standard where possible. All I will put in when I get it all together will be Username - CPU - Video Card - Video Ram - 6 frame settings - OS - info. Example:- Hotted up etc. That fills an entire line on my 15" screen. Probably make it a HTML file as it will keep everything in its proper place. I will put a POST here to the effect I posted it and probably call it "BENCHMARK FRAME RATES" Will wait a bit longer to see if a few more will put their settings in. Hope so, more the merrier, I mean better.
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Lars (13 posts)
Dec-21-01, 05:10 AM (EST) 42. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" I'm happy to have been of assistance to you John I fully understand your method of sorting results, no problem. It will be a very valueable source of information indeed, when you're done. All games should be tested this way really, so everybody had a chance to know how their systems performed before buying it. I'm not sure game developpers would agree though...My intention also partly was to show how one can really improve performance by tweaking one's system, and that overclocking is actually a very cost-efficient way of getting high-end performance. Especially in a game like Train-sim, where every single fps counts. I'm still puzzled with the somewhat mediocre performance of this game, especially when I compare it to FS2002. But that's another story, we'll save for later... Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Dec-26-01, 11:48 PM (EST) 43. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hi Folks,To those here who took part in putting their MSTS Basic Frame rates in here, I have posted a post called BENCHMARK FRAME RATES here in the GENERAL forum only.The frame rate settings are in an HTM file. Best I could do, not a PC guru.
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henry3 (476 posts)
Dec-27-01, 11:52 AM (EST) 46. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" It looks like I'm a bit late, but here we go. I finally replaced the cruddy video card. Settings as per instructions.Althon 1.4 Ghz
Soyo "Dragon 7" Plus mainboard
512 MB DDR
Radeon 7500 graphics card, 64 MBSetting 1 32 fps Shift+1 36 fps
2 31 fps
3 27 fps
4 25 fps
5 n/a
6 59 fps
Graphics card as received, no tweaks.Take care!Henry Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
cr8250 (4 posts)
Jan-06-02, 09:50 PM (EST) 47. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Frame rates are based on recommended settings for this board.AMD Athlon Tbird 1 Ghz
Iwill KK266
Windows 98 (not SE)
128mb PC133 ram
Visiontek GeForce 2mx 32mb
Detonator v23.11 drivers
DirectX 8.0Frame Rates:
1 Key: 30
2 Key: 25
3 Key: 20
4 Key: 24
6 Key: 50
Shift 1: 32Hope this helps your research.Jeff W. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Jan-07-02, 03:07 AM (EST) 48. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Jeff,Thanks for your settings, it all helps. Is appreciated. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
TAfan (195 posts)
Jan-07-02, 05:48 PM (EST) 49. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Everything as instructed, set to 1024×768×16:My system is:
---------------------------
Intel Pentium III-500mhz running Windows 98 SE.
AGP Creative 3D Blaster GeForce2 Ti 64MB graphics card. (as out of box, no tweaking)Chaintech CT-6BTM ATX (100mz) Motherboard.
256 SDRAM (100mz)
Nvidia Drivers : Detonator XP v21.83 Windows 95/98/Me.
DirectX 8.0a
17" Taxan 755 TCO99 monitor
Creative Sound Blaster Live! Platinum 5.1Key 1 (cab view) 13fps
Key 2 (outside view) 13fps.
Key 3 (rear view) 10fps
Key 4 (camera view) 9fps
Key 6 (coupling view) 46fps.Sorry, I forgot to do Shift+1! Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Jan-07-02, 08:15 PM (EST) 50. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Thanks TAfan,The shift+1 is not all that important. I chucked that in as well because a frame rate can be measured by using it, and may be of interest as well.John
S.A.R. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
ozinoz (121 posts)
Jan-08-02, 09:26 PM (EST) 51. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" I have just updated my PC at home (a saga in itself in relation to XP, and then the hard drive "died" altogether)I was running a Celeron 800, Win XP, MSI Main board, 512 meg ram and Geforce2 400MX card. Rates were as follows;-
key 1 13
key 2 8
key 3 16
key 4 8
key 6 20
shift1 14I have now upgraded to a P4 1.5, 768 meg ram and Geforce3 TI200 card. New rates are;-
key 1 31
key 2 29
key 3 38
key 4 22
key 6 50
shift1 31So far I have had 2 upgrades to run TS to my satisfaction. It has cost an absolute bomb. The new card appears great (3dMark 2001 score went from 1560 to 5365!!)I am sooooooooooo happyOZ
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ecpfeifer (2 posts)
Jan-16-02, 04:10 AM (EST) 52. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hi John,here's my contribution:Mobo: ABIT KG7
Graphics: Leadtek Winfast GTS/Pro (64 MB DDR)
Disk: 2 IBM IC35L040 in RAID 0 configuration
RAM: 512 MB DDR CL2
CPU: Athlon TB 1400
OS: Win2K Pro, SP 2 and a couple bug fixes
DirectX: 8.0aeverything running at specs, no overclocking/tweakingMy results at 1024*768*16 (32 bit color depth in parantheses):1: 37 (38)
2: 25 (36)
3: 25 (29)
4: 26 (27)
6: 38 (59)
S1: 38 (38)Got no idea as to how much this may affect performance of MSTS but I usually have got a few programs running in parallel: fax, answering machine, online counter, fire wall, and anti-virus.Best regards
Eberhard Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
ecpfeifer (2 posts)
Jan-16-02, 04:13 AM (EST) 53. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" Hi,just a little addition to this:Graphics driver: Leadtek Winfast 11031Best
Eberhard Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jm1941 (166 posts)
Jan-16-02, 05:36 PM (EST) 54. "RE: More BASIC FRAME RATES" G'day Eberhard,Thanks for your contribution is still appreciated.I run my MSTS and FltSims on two seperate removable hard drives using old Win98 with Norton SystemWorks and Antivirus and a couple of other small thingo's running. I find no difference in frames, if they are ON or OFF.
I have seen much ado about background gear robbing frames. But I have not yet seen it in my test or for that matter in MSTS running.
Okay background programs will rob system RAM, only IF you do not have enough of it (I have 256megs find that quite okay) but in a basic test like this I definately find no difference in frames at all. So in my book do not bother to turn off background programs to run this "Basic Frame rate" test.By the way I just use the latest Nvdia drivers from Nvdia. Never bothered with Windfast drivers from when I first installed my GeForce2 GTS/Pro card. Has always gone okay. Well I'm happy with it. The last 3 Nvidia upgrades found no difference at all, so will stay with what I got for now.John
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