DCForum Discussion Forum - Disappearing threads

Anyone know what happened to Georgi55's thread regarding Trainz service pack 3? It was here this morning. I can't seem to find it now.Paul

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RE: Disappearing threads, Xacto, May-31-02, 06:37 PM, (1) RE: Disappearing threads, Gazza, May-31-02, 06:56 PM, (3) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, May-31-02, 06:55 PM, (2) RE: Disappearing threads, Stumbl, May-31-02, 06:58 PM, (4) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, May-31-02, 07:42 PM, (7) RE: Disappearing threads, DKlemm, May-31-02, 07:35 PM, (5) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, May-31-02, 07:40 PM, (6) RE: Disappearing threads, Stumbl, May-31-02, 09:01 PM, (8) RE: Disappearing threads, PaulD, May-31-02, 10:23 PM, (9) RE: Disappearing threads, DKlemm, May-31-02, 10:56 PM, (10) RE: Disappearing threads, joha107, May-31-02, 10:58 PM, (11) RE: Disappearing threads, PaulD, May-31-02, 11:28 PM, (12) RE: Disappearing threads, kevarc, May-31-02, 11:32 PM, (13) RE: Disappearing threads, Stumbl, May-31-02, 11:48 PM, (14) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 00:09 AM, (15) RE: Disappearing threads, kevarc, Jun-01-02, 00:18 AM, (16) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 00:22 AM, (17) RE: Disappearing threads, LawrenceKellie, Jun-01-02, 01:09 AM, (18) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 01:50 AM, (19) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 01:52 AM, (20) RE: Disappearing threads, LawrenceKellie, Jun-01-02, 10:57 AM, (30) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 11:42 AM, (32) RE: Disappearing threads, LawrenceKellie, Jun-01-02, 04:09 PM, (33) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 04:15 PM, (34) RE: Disappearing threads, LawrenceKellie, Jun-01-02, 05:35 PM, (36) RE: Disappearing threads, Southern_Railway, Jun-01-02, 05:00 PM, (35) RE: Disappearing threads, calr, Jun-01-02, 01:55 AM, (21) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 02:02 AM, (22) RE: Disappearing threads, obo, Jun-01-02, 02:35 AM, (23) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 03:01 AM, (24) RE: Disappearing threads, obo, Jun-01-02, 05:35 AM, (25) RE: Disappearing threads, troub, Jun-01-02, 09:58 AM, (26) RE: Disappearing threads, troub, Jun-01-02, 10:01 AM, (27) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 10:06 AM, (28) RE: Disappearing threads, georgi55, Jun-01-02, 10:12 AM, (29) RE: Disappearing threads, PaulD, Jun-01-02, 11:26 AM, (31)

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It might have been moved to the Trainz section of the forums. Cliff

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Which was a damn shame, as I'm sure he posted it here so EVERYONE (MSTS'ers included) would see it.Many people who may be interested in it will probably miss it now.
Gazza

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I asked moderator to delete it because MSTS v.s. Trainz started again.
Few people on this forum seems to LOVE that topic and as soon as they see "Trainz" they start jumping on with attacks.
It was just a post so people who would never look into Trainz forum look at it and see what's happening with Trainz defelopment.
Also, someone in that thread replied to me that I posted in in MSTS forum.
No I did not post in MSTS forum, I posted it in General forum.
Georgi

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yeah , uh huhh , here we go again
i said in the train sim forum
Make a Mess!!
I am

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>yeah , uh huhh , here
>we go again
>i said in the train sim
>forum
>
>
>Make a Mess!!
>I am You're signiture really explains somethin! lol
Well, its is fact that I didnt post in MSTS forum.Georgi

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Georgi;It only became a us them in your eyes. You challenged a response to a comment on 3d sound. Grow up.David Klemm
Illinois Central Route
Illinois and St Louis Divisions
Ver 0.8 uploaded
Decatur IL 51% done, off playing with trains and doing research for the next update!

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>Grow up. WOW! I see many people hear who can say "grow up" to me, but "grow up" from you doesnt make any sense and is the biggest joke!Georgi

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LOL , and NOT at anyone , except maybe myself.
it is a fact georgi , yes , but i still absolutely refuse to grow up.... hehehe
Make a Mess!!
I am

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Let us review the heading for this forum..."General
General railroading forum, for topics not specific to any one simulator."So..a. Georgi, you had every right to post it here.b. It should not be moved to the Trainz forum.c. The news is of interest to those of us who use both MSTS and Trainz and perhaps those MSTS users who have considered Trainz but have not tried it yet.As far as the few assholes who insist on perpetuating the animosity between the two platforms, screw them. It seems it's more of a territory issue than a Trainz vs MSTS issue (how dare you post in my space...)It would be nice to see some cooperation for once. Did you know that Trainz and MSTS content can be shared at the GMAX/3D Max level? Most Trainz users would kill for some of the content that MSTS already has and there's lots of Trainz content that I'm sure MSTS users would be interested in. For instance, there are presently two different Big Boys in the works for Trainz and an Acela that blows Microsoft's one away. Let's not forget the famous Rocket Cow! All that would be required is an exchange of MAX files. Why re-invent the wheel twice?It looks like Service Pack 3 is going to go a long way towards making Trainz a full fledged train simulator instead of a toy train simulator. I think it's time to put an end to the binary bigotry.Paul

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Couldn't agree more Paul. I thought Georgi provided some useful information about 3d sound being added to Trainz. Another person asked what was 3d sound and a person answered him using the word MSTS in the sentance. Georgi replied, here we go again. What the heck was that for. I thought it was great about the additions in service pack 3.
David Klemm
Illinois Central Route
Illinois and St Louis Divisions
Ver 0.8 uploaded
Decatur IL 51% done, off playing with trains and doing research for the next update!

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LAST EDITED ON May-31-02 AT 11:01 PM (EDT)I am going to clear this up for all of you.
1. i don't think anyone said anything about msts vs. trainz, nor did anyone say he didn't have a right to put it in the general forum.2. Stumbl said train-sim forum not msts forum. read don't scan. 3. georgi was pointing something out about trainz not starting an argument.4. spell checkers for everybody! woohoo!
joe

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>LAST EDITED ON May-31-02
>AT 11:01 PM (EDT)
>
>I am going to clear this
>up for all of you.
>
>1. i don't think anyone said
>anything about msts vs. trainz,
>nor did anyone say he
>didn't have a right to
>put it in the general
>forum.
>
>2. Stumbl said train-sim forum not
>msts forum. read don't scan.
>
>
>3. georgi was pointing something out
>about trainz not starting an
>argument.
>
>4. spell checkers for everybody! woohoo!
>
>
>
>
>
>joe
Joe, I wasn't referring to posts in this thread specifically or literally. This has unfortunately been an ongoing problem ever since Trainz was in beta testing. A few over zealeous people showed up here and started spouting off very undiplomatically about how wonderful Trainz was and that MSTS sucks, and so the war began. The rest of us have been suffering for it ever since.Paul

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Can you guess who one of the them was? georgiKevin Arceneaux

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LOL@joe , hehehe , you speelled wooooohoooooo wrong.
Paul , you seem to have missed most of it , but thats ok....
georgi , make a mess comes from havin to tell the kids to clean up all the time , even that gets a little old....lol
Make a Mess!!
I am

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>Can you guess who one of
>the them was? georgi
>
>
>Kevin Arceneaux LOL LOL LOL LOL! Let's face the fact here.
I have never bashed MSTS, NEVER. As I have said hunderets times, I love both games/simulators or however you want to categorize them.Georgi

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Yeah, say what you like, but you always are the lighting rod.Kevin Arceneaux

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LAST EDITED ON Jun-01-02 AT 00:25 AM (EDT)>but
>you always are the lighting
>rod.
>
>Kevin Arceneaux When?
THIS IS FUN!:p
Georgi

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>>Can you guess who one of
>>the them was? georgi
>>
>>
>>Kevin Arceneaux
>
>LOL LOL LOL LOL! Let's face
>the fact here.
>I have never bashed MSTS, NEVER.
>As I have said hunderets
>times, I love both games/simulators
>or however you want to
>categorize them.
>
>Georgi Georgi, please realize that "never" is a very dangerous word to use.For example, the message at this link http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID9/194.html#1 could very easily be considered MSTS bashing.and this one: http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID3/9197.html#26and...http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID3/8419.html#3and...http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID6/4733.html#1And whereas this one is not necessarily bashing, I think it speaks for itself about your desire to inflame: http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID6/4741.html#13So, as you can see, saying "never" is a dangerous thing to do.Lawrence

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Hmmm...let's analyze it.http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID9/194.html#1:
And they call Microsoft's one "Simulator" and "As Real As it Gets"...
Yes, the screenshot in that post looked more realistic than MSTS.http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID3/9197.html#26
I jsut realized, MSTS Aids were hell for people who cant play at 1026*768 resolution...look at the screenshot on above's post...its taking up the whole screen!
This was my comment because I felt sorry for people who could run only at 640*480 - and I was happy for them now that they can make them trancpatrent.http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID3/8419.html#3:
I completely agree. MSTS is one of most buggiest thing released by microsoft for last few years. (oh, Don't forget WinMe)
If it is brought up to FS2002 standart of stability, then I have no complanints to be a beta tester.
BTW, if you go to FS2002 Insider by Zone, you will see how MS almost cleary said that we ARE beta testers.
(not exaclty the word, but that's what they ment by context)
Isn't it true? It IS fact that MSTS has more bugs than other games of its time.http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID6/4733.html#1:
And, don't forget, some people have found new and better hobby. lol:P
(putting on flame suit)
I though people undesrtood jokes?http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID6/4741.html#13:

>Georgi55
>
>Trying to start another flame war?
Yes
> Don't stoop to
>troll status. Your comment
>didn't answer Jeff's question and
>only purpose was to be
>a dig.
So?

I was pissed off because the original topic of that thread was putting down Trainz.Anymore?Georgi

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The above post proves NEVER.
Georgi

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Please reread my post, as you missed the point of it. And since you missed the two main points, I will reiterate them clearer.1. "Never" is a very dangerous word to use. All I have to do is find one example and it totally negates the statement containing the word "never."2. I did not say you *were* bashing MSTS, I said "could very easily be considered MSTS bashing." The "could" makes all the difference in the world. And since there are at least one MSTS user who believes that every post in response to an original post is the responsibility of the original poster, this means that this person, at least, would place blame on you for any response after the "could-be" bashing statement.Now for a new point.It does appear, Georgi, that when you get upset about something, you post vehement statements; then when you have time to think about it, you apologize. Wouldn't it be easier to just refrain from posting? Because, I think that you have gotten a reputation on this board of posting flame-like (do not miss the "like" word), could-be-bashing, vulgar (swearing) posts. This means that when people see a post by georgi55, that post is *already* handicapped by your past as being potentially (don't miss that word) flames, bashing, vulgarity. This is not a nice reputation to have; and further, as I have mentioned either here or on the T board, you are really doing a disservice to the T community by those types of posts. Because of this, I know of at least one MSTS user (and I am certain there are more) who view T with total disdain and contempt--regardless of how good or bad T or MSTS is. This person has stated privately to me and publicly here that he/she will never ever consider putting T on his/her computer.On to happier thoughts. There are several/many MSTS users who for whatever reason will not have anything to do with "T." MSTS is a fine simulator, but it has some shortcomings. T is a fine simulator (or game, if you rather), but it, too, has some shortcomings. But one thing going for T, which appears to be missing with MSTS, is that the developers have responded, are responding, and will respond to the comments/wishes of the T community--and I don't mean responding in the sense of just posting responses to message, but responding by reshaping the product.I would encourage every person to read the post by T's CEO, Greg Lane, found at http://www.auran.com/trainz/forum/showthread.php?s=bad4c2b5c456679fe5b13cd7649fc725&threadid=11210 .This is absolutely incredible. It is really a version 2.0, but being distributed *free* as a service patch.I would like to include two paragraphs from his statement which describes the nature of the product to come:"For example, a passenger gets sick and you’re a long way from anywhere (outback Australia maybe). The conductor calls the Flying Doctor service on the radio (which you actually hear), you stop the train beside an old disused airfield and watch the King Air circle and land beside the train before the passenger is loaded aboard, it takes off again and you’re on your way again all done with complete audio and visual effects that are timed to perfection. The interaction is just awesome. "And..."SP3 supports road densities via the objects configuration file. Your dirt roads and freeways can have different traffic densities to standard road. In fact, you can even have the standard road in three varieties if you wish; light, medium and heavy traffic."Both of these are examples of what is being developed.A final interesting point, about this year's E3. One visitor to the MS display asked about MSTS. This is the visitor's statement about this: "The Microsoft area was huge but neither Train Simulator nor Flight Simulaor was present. Combat Sim 3 was in the booth. A Microsoftie told me that Train Simulator was not at the show because it was 'not shipping this year'."Lawrence

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May I ask you waht's your user name in T board?
Georgi

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>May I ask you waht's your
>user name in T board?
>
>Georgi Yes you may ask. Lawrence

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>>May I ask you waht's your
>>user name in T board?
>>
>>Georgi
>
>Yes you may ask.
>
>
>Lawrence Oh - that one was tricky Georgi

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I have given several clues over there that ___________ is Lawrence Kellie. You should be able to find out. You're bright enough.Lawrence

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LOL

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It is very ironic, that this thread started out by asking what happened to a particular thread that was deleted. I have a feeling that this thread is headed for the chopping block next but I am not going to push the button.
Cal Rasmussen
Beaverton, OR
I'm an excellent speler. I jus can't type worth a damn!
Columbia Gorge Route (15% done, The Dalles yard and dam in progress)

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>It is very ironic, that this
>thread started out by asking
>what happened to a particular
>thread that was deleted. How true. And DKlemm, if you look back, you started the whole thing in this thread.
Think twice before telling someone to grow up.
http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID1/1406.html#5Georgi

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Two points.1. The integrity of these forums will be compromised if threads continue to be removed without good reason.2. It's not the fighting but the people that whine about the fighting that are causing the problems.Rob.

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>Two points.
>
>1. The integrity of these forums
>will be compromised if threads
>continue to be removed without
>good reason.
>
>2. It's not the fighting but
>the people that whine about
>the fighting that are causing
>the problems.
>
>Rob. Rob, just to point out the thread that was removed was posted by my, a flame was started by others, therefore I alerted it to be removed.And I totally agree with #2...never thoght about it that way.Georgi

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Georgi,I understand the situation, but my concern is that when an entire discussion gets wiped we lose useful content as well, and your thread is a perfect example of this. As things stand now a troublemaker can get any thread deleted simply by starting a flame war in it. To make this really easy he could even create two accounts and argue with himself, which is a standard tactic for trolls.And your response to my second point totally floored me - it's the response every writer dreams of.Cheers,Rob.

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LAST EDITED ON Jun-01-02 AT 09:58 AM (EDT)Ok, I posted to the missing trainz thread, I guess just before it was removed. I don't suppose anyone saw my post, so I'll reiterate here.Yes, that thread had every right to be in the General forum. Others have stated that already, so that point has already been made.Apparently, however, everyone seems to have missed what really started the MSTS vs. Trainz bickering in that thread.Georgi mentioned that Trainz SP3 will provide 3d spatial sound. Someone asked what is 3D sound? Georgi replied that it means when you're in the cab, and trains pass you, you hear their noise from the appropriate direction. The noise of your own engine is heard from the rear speakers (if you have a surround setup). Then, Georgi added (paraphrased), "In MSTS all you hear is the Katan Koton engine noise, and a Wheeeeeeeen sound from all speakers".To me, that sounded like the start of a debate, and indeed it was. Others responded that there is indeed spatial sound in MSTS by giving various examples. Georgi then said "here we go again."Uh, excuse me?Yes, indeed, grow up. Personally, I'm planning on buying Trainz. It looks neat, and it looks fun. There is a place for both, and most people seem to realize that. A few however, like to perpetuate this myth of a great rift between the two "societies." Why? Who the hell knows.troub
MSTS: Illinois Central

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"Rob, just to point out the thread that was removed was posted by my, a flame was started by others, therefore I alerted it to be removed."
-georgiAs said in my post above, the "flame war" (which it wasn't, even) was started by YOU, but unfortunately since the thread is gone now, all evidence of that has been removed. Hmmm, that's odd. . .troub
MSTS: Illinois Central

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Yes, I was talking about when a train passes by you.
You don't hear the train from right or left or front or back,
but all the sudden you hear LOUD sound of engine and that train saying Katan Koton till you pass by, and all the sudeen that sound stops.
Georgi

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And, for those who stated that that Trainz sound is shitter than MSTS and it my speaker problem(which is not), go to this thread.
I wonder why the very first wish is better sound...
http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/DCForumID3/9136.html
Georgi

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And once again a discussion about preventing the flame wars has turned in to, you guessed it, a flame war!As I look over the last dozen posts I am reminded of a bunch of 8 year olds squabbling. Most of it, at least, is about who posted what. As far as sound goes, in MSTS you here certain sounds in the cab, in Trainz you hear also heard certain sounds in the cab. They are different from each other, YOU CAN'T CHANGE THAT! It's the way the programs were written. GET OVER IT! Discussing the differences is one thing, flaming over it is childish and unproductive. MSTS has a nice doppler effect that Trainz doesn't have. Trainz on the other hand, has positional sound in the cab that MSTS doesn't have.For some reason the above type of statement always seems to degrade to:"Trainz has great sound and MSTS sucks and you are a jerk and an asshole.""Oh yeah? Well Trainz sounds are crap and your mother wears army boots and you breath is so bad you could knock a buzzard off a sh** wagon (old George Carlin)."The main problem is that there are people here who really need to take some anger management courses and others who need to stop baiting the people who can't control their tempers.Paul

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