Scenario building

Can anyone comment on the scenario building in Trainz? Basically, is it any easier than MSTS? I really hate having to spend the same amount of time building an activity as it takes to play one. IMO there should've been some sort of random activity generation program with MSTS. How does Trainz stack up?

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RE: Scenario building, tark1054, Jan-27-03, 12:52 PM, (1) RE: Scenario building, dvdhoven, Jan-27-03, 01:12 PM, (2) RE: Scenario building, Boweavel, Jan-27-03, 01:27 PM, (3) RE: Scenario building, MikeA, Jan-27-03, 06:01 PM, (4) RE: Scenario building, dvdhoven, Jan-28-03, 12:28 PM, (8) RE: Scenario building, crow357, Jan-27-03, 10:20 PM, (5) RE: Scenario building, rabid_david, Jan-28-03, 11:13 AM, (6) RE: Scenario building, kevarc, Jan-28-03, 11:46 AM, (7) RE: Scenario building, dvdhoven, Jan-28-03, 12:41 PM, (9) RE: Scenario building, kevarc, Jan-28-03, 12:51 PM, (10) RE: Scenario building, MikeA, Jan-28-03, 02:46 PM, (11) RE: Scenario building, kevarc, Jan-28-03, 03:25 PM, (12) RE: Scenario building, MikeA, Jan-28-03, 03:48 PM, (13) RE: Scenario building, crow357, Jan-28-03, 07:02 PM, (14) RE: Scenario building, kevarc, Jan-28-03, 09:29 PM, (15) RE: Scenario building, crow357, Jan-28-03, 10:59 PM, (16) RE: Scenario building, kevarc, Jan-28-03, 11:52 PM, (17) RE: Scenario building, crow357, Jan-29-03, 08:34 AM, (18) RE: Scenario building, throttlejcky, Feb-10-03, 11:49 PM, (19)

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YES--YES--YES--and you won't have the RE crashes that MSTS has...MSTS has an extremely poorly designed RE!! I can't tell you how many times I have built a route over hundreds of hours and have it crash and not be able to recover it. I have had only one problem with Trainz and I had to reinstall it...maybe if I were more conversant with the program I wouldn't have had to..but none the less I simply placed my route folder back into the trainz reinstall and reinstalled the custom objects and viola!!!back up and running. The only thing I wish is that there were a gamma correction somewhere in the program. I need to take all the custom bits into photoshop and brighten them up some. But I don't have that dismal dreary Trainz atmosphere that is built into the standard stuff.

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Hi,tark1054, do we read different things?
He is asking about scenario building and compares that to MSTS activity building and you are talking about making layouts and route editors.What so ever.
Scenario building is much much more difficult then creating an Activity in MSTS.Scenarios need to be created in a script that most resembles the C++ programming language.The other site is that you can do much more with a Trainz scenario. You can do things, you only can dream in a MSTS Activity.Some third party add ons are coming on the market, to assist you with the scenario creating process.To get some idea, here are some links:
http://members.lycos.co.uk/smileyman2k2/index.htm
http://members.shaw.ca/paulsid/trainz/Miniland.html
http://www.trainzassistancecommunity.com/
http://www.maxtrainz.com/creationz/Dick van den Hoven

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Have you been turned to the TRAINZ side dvdhoven Catchya

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I have.Awesome. MSTS: get a clue.MikeA

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LAST EDITED ON Jan-28-03 AT 12:44 PM (EST)

Hi,Boweavel, the answer is yes and no.
The truth is that I have Trainz from the first Comunity Release. And upgraded it with every Service pack.
Now I have UTC.
But I did not much with it. And the last time I am investigating what can be done in Trainz and what not.
And I must say it surprised me in the good sense of the word. There is much possible, but the scenario writing is another part. Rather difficult, but what is possible with scenarios is great.And my personal opionion is that both simulators can peacefully live together. And may be some day we get a simulator with the best of both. Who knows?Personal I prefer that people live in harmony together. I don't like the idea of this side and that side.
Trainz has advantages and disadvantages and MSTS has them either.I never have seen Trainz as an enemy.Dick van den Hoven

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Cool Beans. Guess I'll have to order it then. I've taught myself C and Visual Basic. Perhaps some sort of programming aid could be created to facilitate the creation of scenarios.

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LAST EDITED ON Jan-28-03 AT 11:14 AM (EST)

>Can anyone comment on the scenario building in Trainz?
>Basically, is it any easier than MSTS? I really hate having
>to spend the same amount of time building an activity as it
>takes to play one. IMO there should've been some sort of
>random activity generation program with MSTS. How does
>Trainz stack up? Driving in Trainz is great fun, and making layouts/routes couldn't be easier. Creating scenarios/activities however is a more involved affair and requires mastery of "TrainzScript"; a java-like programming language. It allows access to a great deal of low-level functionality but unless you like programming you will find it a painful experience. This is a great shame as the rest of Trainz is very easy to get to grips with, and in this respect MSTS's Activity Editor wins hands down despite it's limitations (hardcore TrainzScript programmers will fiercely deny this ).Certain third parties have created TrainzScript Generators which can create blocks of script to paste into your scenario script, but only a true point-and-click GUI scenario editor where the user does not have to battle with lines of tedious code will save the day. Don't get me wrong I love Trainz, but in it's current form any serious attempt at creating realistic operations and/or timetabling will be beyond the vast majority of users. A comparison of the handful of scenarios available for Trainz since SP3 was released against the large number of activities created for MSTS in the same period would seem to back this up.

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This seals it. Until trainz has a activity editor that does not require progamming it will not be bought by me. What is the use of a sim that you really do not have a purpose? I very seldom explore route except to get a feel and look at the oppurtunities for activities. I don't like to run just to run.Kevin Arceneaux
It is time for Amtrak to become a fallen flag!

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Hi,Kevin the truth is that the scenario writing is difficult as you have to go into the script directly.
Some guys are developing third party tools to make this scripting much easier.
The expectation is that Auran will release a script editor with the release of the module Yard Master. The scenario script is developed for Yard Master.And don't forget. Explore route in Trainz is not equal Explore Route in MSTS.
As Trainz has the multi consist model and consist can do Autopilot, you can place a lot of consists on your layout (= Route in MSTS) and let them run on their own.
You can pickup one consist and take control of that one. While playing you can take control of an other consist. So you can place cars every where and go out and collect them and place them on an other place. You don't need any scenario (activity in MSTS) for this.
What in MSTS is regretted the most for Explore Route, stuffing the route with cars and AI, is possible in Trainz.
Pathes are unknown in Trainz. A layout builder places start points on the track. The player can put consists on every start point.
Consist building is easy, but somewhat tedious as you have to scroll through a long list of cars and locos.
And you have to do that, every time you start the game. You can save it, but only one set of consists, just as you have created them in a session.
Lucky there is a third party tool that can create consists easier and can save them outside Trainz.Dick van den Hoven

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Dick, I just plain don't like explore route. I much prefer an activity with a goal to accomplish and I don't want to go through all the hoops when you start up Trainz. To me is is still model trains.Kevin Arceneaux
It is time for Amtrak to become a fallen flag!

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If the most important thing to you is creating "Activities," then clearly, MSTS is your bailywick. No need to toss rocks at Trainz because it hasn't yet "dumbed-down" activity creation to the MSTS level.I know, you hate me. Oh well.Regards,MikeA

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?I didn't toss rocks at Trainz. I just said until the activity creation is made easier that I was not interested in it.Kevin Arceneaux
It is time for Amtrak to become a fallen flag!

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Sorry . . .I will defend your right to that opinion.MikeA

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Well, I'm so frustrated with MSTS's ability to screw itself up, I just want a sim that will start without a dozen error messages. I just tried to install that Ohio Rail route from Rich Garber. Fired up MSTS after it got done and I have to click through a dozen error messages about missing consists. I go back out, uninstall the route in Add/Remove programs, delete the route folder, re-start the program and guess what? The same dang error messages!I really don't care how complicated Trainz' activity creator is, at least I'd be able to RUN it!Please pardon me for ranting.

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You didn't delete the consists. That is wh you still get the error messages. I haven't had any problems getting any of the routes to run, just follow directions and maybe a little fix or two. Kevin Arceneaux
It is time for Amtrak to become a fallen flag!

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LAST EDITED ON Jan-28-03 AT 11:00 PM (EST)

Sorry bud, there's no instructions on what consists to delete.. I also tried reinstalling the route and it didn't help. I just removed MSTS from the hard drive. I'll re-install when I've got a couple hours to kill.

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Run route riter, it will tell you.Kevin Arceneaux
It is time for Amtrak to become a fallen flag!

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Thanks man, I've never heard of that... I'll browse the file section if I can get in..

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I too have become weary of MSTS. Maybe they will be able to make the proper correction in the second version!
I have been looking into TrainZ the past month or so and really like it. I am more interested in creating routes and not really worried about creating activities yet.
Lots of good feedback so far. Hopefully I will purchase TrainZ and create my route finally.

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