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"Durability bug also?"

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flarrfan (238 posts)
Aug-10-01, 07:16 AM (EST) "Durability bug also?" I have now tested a new activity twice. Didn't pay much attention to the first evaluation, but this second one has me thinking there's a serious bug here. Despite fairly liberal use of braking, particularly on those two nasty downgrades just east of Coram, I had no in-train force exceeded comments in any area of the Whitefish-Essex run until I got to Essex Pit. My first thought on looking at this was that use of loco brakes to control speed while switching the difficult grades on the Pit track caused most of the problems, but then I took a closer look...note that every exceed comment in the evaluation is at exactly 30-second intervals. Also, how in the world could I go from MP 1170.20 to 1172.39 in 30 seconds? How do you have excessive in-train forces when you're at a dead stop at MP 1170.20 for almost 3 minutes? What the heck could be doing this?ACTIVITY: Essex Turn 1
You completed this Activity after 2 hours, 9 minutes and 51 seconds of driving.
MINOR OPERATIONAL ERRORS:
You committed no minor operational errors.
WORK ORDER ADHERENCE:
Task Status
--------------------------------------------------------------
Drop off cars at location. Completed
Pick up cars Completed
Drop off cars at location. Completed
Pick up cars Completed
Drop off cars at location. Completed SPEED LIMIT ADHERENCE:
You didn't exceed the speed limit.IN-TRAIN FORCES:
You exceeded freight durability levels 40 times. Forces within the train could have damaged freight.08:08:45 - at mile post 1170.20.
08:09:15 - at mile post 1170.20.
08:09:45 - at mile post 1170.20.
08:10:15 - at mile post 1170.20.
08:10:45 - at mile post 1170.20.
08:11:15 - at mile post 1170.20.
08:11:45 - at mile post 1172.39.
08:12:15 - at mile post 1172.42.
08:12:45 - at mile post 1172.44.
08:13:15 - at mile post 1172.47.
08:13:45 - at mile post 1172.47.
08:21:21 - at mile post 1172.12.
08:21:51 - at mile post 1172.12.
08:22:21 - at mile post 1172.50.
08:22:51 - at mile post 1172.38.
08:23:21 - at mile post 1172.16.
08:23:51 - at mile post 1171.90.
08:24:21 - at mile post 1171.63.
08:24:51 - at mile post 1171.41.
08:25:21 - at mile post 1171.25.
08:25:51 - at mile post 1171.08.
08:26:21 - at mile post 1170.89.
08:26:51 - at mile post 1170.70.
08:27:21 - at mile post 1170.52.
08:27:51 - at mile post 1170.35.
08:28:21 - at mile post 1169.41.
08:28:51 - at mile post 1169.26.
08:29:21 - at mile post 1169.16.
08:29:51 - at mile post 1169.08.
08:30:21 - at mile post 1169.02.
08:30:51 - at mile post 1168.99.
08:31:22 - at mile post 1168.99.
08:31:52 - at mile post 1168.96.
08:32:22 - at mile post 1168.97.
08:32:52 - at mile post 1169.03.
08:33:22 - at mile post 1169.07.
08:33:52 - at mile post 1169.06.
08:34:22 - at mile post 1169.03.
08:34:52 - at mile post 1169.02.
08:35:22 - at mile post 1169.02.
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Table of Contents

Subject Author Message Date ID RE: Durability bug also? Vince Aug-11-01 1 RE: Durability bug also? flarrfan Aug-11-01 2 RE: Durability bug also? SuperDave Aug-12-01 3 RE: Durability bug also? flarrfan Aug-12-01 4 RE: Durability bug also? dcrano Aug-13-01 5 RE: Durability bug also? flarrfan Aug-13-01 6 RE: Durability bug also? GaryG Aug-14-01 7

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Vince (15 posts)
Aug-11-01, 03:16 PM (EST) 1. "RE: Durability bug also?" You know, I had EXACTLY the same bug on a downloaded activity "Freight From Washington" on the NE Corridor route. Mileposts of course were different and all 40 exceeded limits occurred before passing New Carrolton northbound. Subsequent re-runs of the activity had NO errors of this type. Weird.Vince Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
flarrfan (238 posts)
Aug-11-01, 05:56 PM (EST) 2. "RE: Durability bug also?" I asked my testers on this activity to send me their evaluations. One had NO ZIP ZERO ZILCH NADA problems noted on the In-train forces, same exact activity file. Go figure. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
SuperDave (21 posts)
Aug-12-01, 03:10 PM (EST) 3. "RE: Durability bug also?" Hi Flarrfan,I haven't run the activity, but does it by chance use the MSTS default tank car(s) "US2ChemiCar"? When I was developing WFL 2081 Episode 1, I noticed that coupling directly to this tank car constantly gave me the "Exceeded Durability ..." messages. The message also appeared any time I tried to stop and reverse direction (while coupled). Removing that tanker from the pickup consist eliminated the problem. So, I've been sticking with the "US2FreightCar3" as a tank car in my "drivable" consists.(Didn't notice this possibility in any other posts, so hope it's not a repeat)Hope this helps ... Dave Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
flarrfan (238 posts)
Aug-12-01, 11:10 PM (EST) 4. "RE: Durability bug also?" Nope, no tank cars in the activity. I think it's just another bug, er, I mean feature Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
dcrano (2 posts)
Aug-13-01, 02:34 AM (EST) 5. "RE: Durability bug also?" Not a problem here. But at the pit, I apply enough train brake to hold the consist, then power down the grade. This helps keep everything nice and tight all the way down.
ACTIVITY: Essex Turn 1You completed this Activity after 2 hours, 9 minutes and 45 seconds of driving.MINOR OPERATIONAL ERRORS:
You committed no minor operational errors.
WORK ORDER ADHERENCE:
Task Status
--------------------------------------------------------------
Drop off cars at location. Completed
Pick up cars Completed
Drop off cars at location. Completed
Pick up cars Completed
Drop off cars at location. Completed SPEED LIMIT ADHERENCE:
You didn't exceed the speed limit.IN-TRAIN FORCES:
Freight durability limits were met. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
flarrfan (238 posts)
Aug-13-01, 06:58 AM (EST) 6. "RE: Durability bug also?" This is the second perfect evaluation I have heard about from a user of ET1. The "hard" box is checked and the durability slider is set a notch or two from the right, so I'm just clueless on why the different results. As far as pit switching (or any other part of an activity for that matter), I have always assumed (that's apparently ass-u-me) that train brakes should be used as little as possible to avoid durability issues, but Don's report certainly casts doubt on that. ??????? Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
GaryG (4 posts)
Aug-14-01, 02:36 AM (EST) 7. "RE: Durability bug also?" HiI've found that using the train brakes is the safest way to
avoid the durability problems.With the Afternoon Run at the first downgrade, I usually coast
the last ten secs or so before entering the tunnel at the start
of the grade, apply a minimum (6 lb) set once speed starts
increasing, then once speed starts increasing again, using just
the amount of dynamics to keep below the 40MPH limit.Once the speed decreases to about 35MPH with the dynamics
released and just coasting, I release the train brakes. The
speed will slowly increase and before it goes over the 40MPH
mark, I give a short 6Lb brake application and release. I
usually need to do this twice.Here's the kicker, leave the train coasting until the tail
crosses over the switch then apply a notch of power. Smooth
changes of power/dynamics are the key. Because brakes are
applied fairly evenly throughout the length of the train, they
don't usually cause the excessive force problems power/dynamics
can cause. Also, until the tailend crosses through that switch,
part of the train is still running downhill. You need to visualize the ups and downs of the terrain causing
the pushing and pulling forces through the length of the train
to visualize some of what is happening. I've also found that
running through switches also cause major forces to the cars
as they pass through them. I've had a coupler break while I
had been coasting through a switch at less than 1MPH with no
power or braking for a couple minutes.This may not be the way to properly handle a real train but it
doesn't do too bad a job with TrainSim at this time.GaryG
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