Track Charts for Conrail

I am Currently Staring My Conrai Line That Starts at Elkhart,IN to Toledo,OH but I can't find any Track Charts to start laying track like the prototypical route. Any Help Woud be AppreciatedChris
Projects:
Cuesta Pass Route: 8% done
C&C RR: 35% done(adding track and better signals)
Conrail Toledo Line: 2% done
Pacifc Parlour Car: 8% done

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RE: Track Charts for Conrail, Railfan727, Mar-09-03, 03:58 PM, (1) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, Texas Eagle 550, Mar-09-03, 04:49 PM, (2) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, ATSF, Mar-10-03, 02:46 AM, (3) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, Texas Eagle 550, Mar-10-03, 04:13 PM, (11) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, xlspecial261, Mar-10-03, 06:02 AM, (4) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, rowie_nq, Mar-10-03, 06:50 AM, (5) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, geoffmayo, Mar-10-03, 06:54 AM, (6) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, Railfan727, Mar-10-03, 02:37 PM, (10) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, wpfan, Mar-10-03, 07:24 AM, (7) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, Tracktramp, Mar-10-03, 07:30 AM, (8) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, geoffmayo, Mar-10-03, 08:29 AM, (9) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, davidbeach, Mar-10-03, 11:50 PM, (12) RE: Track Charts for Conrail, maintainer, Mar-11-03, 04:03 PM, (13)

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LAST EDITED ON Mar-09-03 AT 04:01 PM (EDT)

Chris,Glad to know there's another Conrail route coming our way!If it's any comfort to you, I found track charts to be only secondary in importance. They don't really give you that good of a picture of how the track is laid out; for that, you'll want a topographical map. DeLorme's "Atlas and Gazetteer" series is very good, and uses the same coordinate datum (WGS84, I believe) as what MSTS uses. They're available at your local Wal-Mart or sporting-goods store (such as Galyan's). Use the information from the maps to write a marker file, and "connect the dots" in the RE.Also, you'll want to make use of TerraServer aerial photographs, available free from terraserver.homeadvisor.msn.com, when it comes time to start placing scenery objects. These images are scaled (you can get up to 1 meter per pixel resolution), so you can get an idea of distances and the sizes of various buildings and objects. You can also use trigonometry to calculate angles of road crossings and such. It's far easier if you save the images (they're 200-by-200-pixel "tiles") to your computer, load them into a graphics editor (Paint Shop Pro or Photoshop or whatever you're comfortable using) and "stitch" them together into one large image.I got my track charts several years ago from the chief dispatcher for the Indianapolis Line...to make a long story short, he came to my school one day (I was in 5th grade, I believe) to give an Operation Lifesaver presentation, and I told him of my lifelong interest in railroading. He gave me a tour of the dispatch facilities, and gave me some memorabilia (including the track charts).You can probably obtain a set of track charts from a railroad-collectibles dealer; several advertise in Trains on a regular basis. If you can't get track charts, an employee timetable would be a good substitute. It won't be as detailed, but should still give you a rough idea of where to put your mileposts and signals and such.About the only use I had for track charts was to figure out where to put mileposts, signals, and defect detectors, and to know what types of warning devices (flashers, gates, or none at all) were at each crossing. You can build a very respectable route without them; in fact, I built the easternomst 20 miles of the Indianapolis Line (between Marion and Mt. Victory) with no track charts at all.You can use the TerraServer photos to get a general idea of the layout of the interlockings, and if you look closely, you can see the control cabins and even the signals themselves in some cases. Block signals are normally placed every 2 to 2.5 miles, and mileposts every mile (5280 feet or 1609 meters). Placement doesn't have to be exact; the "miles" on the Indy Line vary between 4500 and 6200 feet in some places. Use the track sections themselves to measure distances; the straight sections are divided into 25-meter segments, which you can clearly see when the piece is selected.If you need more detailed info, drop me a line at railfan727@yahoo.com.Good luck!Bruce BridgesConrail Indianapolis Line Route

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Thanks for the info. I plan to have the route done by the middle of the summer(i hope) I also have some other routes in the works, I am Currently working on Cuesta Pass I plan to have it done bythe middle of the summer.
Chris
Projects:
Cuesta Pass Route: 8% done
C&C RR: 35% done(adding track and better signals)
Conrail Toledo Line: 2% done
Pacifc Parlour Car: Put on Hold
Upcoming Routes:
ATSF/BNSF Needles SUb
BNSF La Junta Sub
ATSF/BNSF Glorieta Pass

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As info, Glorieta Pass will be released in a month or so.

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OK edited sig and it will be nice to see another ATSF Route Chris
Projects:
Cuesta Pass Route: 8% done
C&C RR: 35% done(adding track and better signals)
Conrail Toledo Line: 2% done
Pacifc Parlour Car: Put on HoldUpcoming Routes:
ATSF/BNSF Needles SUb
BNSF La Junta Sub
BNSF San Bernardino Sub

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>Chris,
>
>Glad to know there's another Conrail route coming our way!
>
>If it's any comfort to you, I found track charts to be only
>secondary in importance. They don't really give you that
>good of a picture of how the track is laid out; for that,
>you'll want a topographical map. DeLorme's "Atlas and
>Gazetteer" series is very good, and uses the same coordinate
>datum (WGS84, I believe) as what MSTS uses. They're
>available at your local Wal-Mart or sporting-goods store
>(such as Galyan's). Use the information from the maps to
>write a marker file, and "connect the dots" in the RE.
>
>Also, you'll want to make use of TerraServer aerial
>photographs, available free from
>terraserver.homeadvisor.msn.com, when it comes time to start
>placing scenery objects. These images are scaled (you can
>get up to 1 meter per pixel resolution), so you can get an
>idea of distances and the sizes of various buildings and
>objects. You can also use trigonometry to calculate angles
>of road crossings and such. It's far easier if you save the
>images (they're 200-by-200-pixel "tiles") to your computer,
>load them into a graphics editor (Paint Shop Pro or
>Photoshop or whatever you're comfortable using) and "stitch"
>them together into one large image.
>
>I got my track charts several years ago from the chief
>dispatcher for the Indianapolis Line...to make a long story
>short, he came to my school one day (I was in 5th grade, I
>believe) to give an Operation Lifesaver presentation, and I
>told him of my lifelong interest in railroading. He gave me
>a tour of the dispatch facilities, and gave me some
>memorabilia (including the track charts).
>
>You can probably obtain a set of track charts from a
>railroad-collectibles dealer; several advertise in
>Trains on a regular basis. If you can't get track
>charts, an employee timetable would be a good substitute. It
>won't be as detailed, but should still give you a rough idea
>of where to put your mileposts and signals and such.
>
>About the only use I had for track charts was to figure out
>where to put mileposts, signals, and defect detectors, and
>to know what types of warning devices (flashers, gates, or
>none at all) were at each crossing. You can build a very
>respectable route without them; in fact, I built the
>easternomst 20 miles of the Indianapolis Line (between
>Marion and Mt. Victory) with no track charts at all.
>
>You can use the TerraServer photos to get a general idea of
>the layout of the interlockings, and if you look closely,
>you can see the control cabins and even the signals
>themselves in some cases. Block signals are normally placed
>every 2 to 2.5 miles, and mileposts every mile (5280 feet or
>1609 meters). Placement doesn't have to be exact; the
>"miles" on the Indy Line vary between 4500 and 6200 feet in
>some places. Use the track sections themselves to measure
>distances; the straight sections are divided into 25-meter
>segments, which you can clearly see when the piece is
>selected.
>
>If you need more detailed info, drop me a line at
>railfan727@yahoo.com.
>
>Good luck!
>
>Bruce Bridges
>
>Conrail Indianapolis Line Route
I'm sorry, but I do not follow this at all.A prototype profile will give you the EXACT grades and curves on the route you are trying to replicate.I do not see how anyone can build a prototypical route without them.I have used profiles to build my route and I must say this;If you have the correct grades to match the prototype, train handling will match prototype. MSTS does do some things fairly well. This is one of them.My route is an earlier version (Milwaukee Road)of the route I run as an engineer for Canadian Pacific. It is built from profile charts and runs just like the real thing.As I see it, profiles are invalable in building a prototypical route.The best place to get profiles would likely be the hysterical society connected with the road you are modeling.There is also a sitew on the net advertising these things for many different roads and routes.Perhaps some body has the URL. (I don't have it handy)Todd

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LAST EDITED ON Mar-10-03 AT 06:52 AM (EDT)

>There is also a sitew on the net advertising these things
>for many different roads and routes.
>
>Perhaps some body has the URL. (I don't have it handy)
>
>Todd This be it http://www.trainsite.8m.comCheers
David

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I'd have to agree with Todd on this one. Track layout is very important for realism and operations. Grades are important for train control. A "best guess" might be okay for some people unfamiliar with the area but anybody with a bit of knowledge would start to pick holes. MS's version of the NEC was terrible in terms of realism - you just couldn't do half the moves that you could in real life, and you couldn't drive the route without the track monitor because the signalling was all wrong.Geoff M.

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I'm sorry, I should have elaborated...I used DEM terrain for my route...getting the grades right was simply a matter of following the terrain. The grades were just about what I expected from the profile on the track charts. As far as the curves go, I did some calculations and approximated the curve radii as follows:0 degree, 30 min: 4000 meter radius (from XTracks)
1 degree, 0 min: 2000 meter radius
2 degree, 0 min: 1000 meter radiusYou can still get the curve radii pretty close just from a topo map. It all depends on how you place your markers.

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Check through historical societies and what not and locate where either Conrail's or the previous owner's record archives are stored. As an example the California State Railroad museum has the archives for the Southern Pacific and are an absolute wealth of information. I was able to get items such as profile charts, station diagrams, industry maps, and yard maps for the mere price of photocopies. Hopefuly wherever your search leads you they have their catalog online for easier searching. Before CSRM finally got their catalog online it was pain in the ass to go to the library only to find out that either A. they didn't have what I was looking for or B. it was stored off site and I was going to have to return at a later date, and I was only living across town at the time.

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Hi,
I just assumed that track charts were going to be an essential part of any route that is supposed to represent real trackage. Fortunately, I met a man from CSX who has been very helpful in providing track charts and yard maps for the route that I am working on ( CSX from Selkirk to Boston). However, even though I have the yard charts I find that the limitations of the program will often make it impossible to follow the chart. There simply are not the track pieces necessary to make it happen. In many cases my yard tracks are much further apart than is actually the case. If I place them closer together the equipment will stall and the yard becomes useless. Until these things are addressed in msts I'll have to cheat. My track will be a close representation but not nearly as realistic ad I would like it. Charlie Brodeur

Charlie B

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You certainly need to use a lot of dynamic track to follow the curves of a real route. As for the yard areas, I modelled a yard 25 tracks wide, expecting it to be way wider than it should be. It turned out to be about 10-20% wider than it should have done, good enough for me. The problem is the 10 degree switches have too long a straight section - it should be about the same length as the curved section.Geoff M.

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The Xtracks modular switches allow the construction of more accurate yards and yard ladders.David Beach.Palouse & LewistonRoute Building 1% Completed
Route Mapping 10% Completed
Route Photo Map 100% Completed (Now, Can I make the Railroad Profile match the photo map?)

Standardized \global\tsection.dat file now at build00016.

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Chris:
I should be able to get you the NS track chart pages for that section within a week or two. Just send me your address.
E-mail to: high-green@charter.net
John
aka 'Maintainer'

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