Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1

Here are the pictures I shot of the I St. bridge near the railroad museum in Sacramento.


Cal Rasmussen
Beaverton, ORColumbia Gorge Route -- 20%
Old McDonalds -- Building done, Sign in progress.

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RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-21-02, 08:23 PM, (1) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, century242, Sep-22-02, 00:02 AM, (5) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-21-02, 09:38 PM, (2) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, calr, Sep-21-02, 09:47 PM, (3) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-21-02, 10:06 PM, (4) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, wp713, Sep-22-02, 00:36 AM, (6) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, pdave1s, Sep-22-02, 01:10 AM, (7) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, calr, Sep-22-02, 12:40 PM, (8) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, Macster, Sep-22-02, 12:47 PM, (9) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, century242, Sep-22-02, 01:13 PM, (10) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-22-02, 01:44 PM, (11) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, calr, Sep-23-02, 01:31 AM, (12) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, JohnCS, Sep-23-02, 07:53 PM, (13) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-23-02, 10:04 PM, (14) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, century242, Sep-23-02, 11:20 PM, (15) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, century242, Sep-24-02, 00:49 AM, (16) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-24-02, 08:12 PM, (17) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, pdave1s, Sep-25-02, 05:09 PM, (18) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-25-02, 06:05 PM, (19) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, pdave1s, Sep-25-02, 11:02 PM, (21) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, century242, Sep-25-02, 10:30 PM, (20) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, griffinmt, Sep-25-02, 11:02 PM, (22) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-26-02, 09:26 PM, (23) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, pdave1s, Sep-26-02, 10:22 PM, (24) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, century242, Sep-26-02, 10:52 PM, (25) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-27-02, 07:30 PM, (26) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, century242, Sep-27-02, 09:47 PM, (28) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-27-02, 10:03 PM, (29) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-27-02, 09:38 PM, (27) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, calr, Sep-28-02, 11:48 AM, (30) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, elwood, Sep-28-02, 03:08 PM, (31) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-29-02, 07:39 PM, (35) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Sep-28-02, 08:25 PM, (32) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, Hawk, Sep-29-02, 02:36 PM, (33) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, pdave1s, Sep-29-02, 03:47 PM, (34) RE: Sacramento I St. Bridge for PDAVE1, rpicardi1, Oct-01-02, 08:10 PM, (36)

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Any idea of the general dimensions of the swing span and approach spans? Near one may be 120ft? far span 180ft? 2 track span bottom deck, narrow 2 lane road top. Swing span 360ft? 40 ft outside to outside width? Design of approach spans similar to the Grand Trunk span in Saginaw.I see a sign on the swing span. Something about a height limit?All the parts except the road deck are already in the TSModeler parts folder in SRVBRDR1.zipSRV Ron

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-22-02 AT 00:08 AM (EDT)

Ron, I can tell you from experience that 2 large trucks just barely squeak by each other on the road portion and the curbs on the road edges are about 1 and a half feet tall with nasty metal edges. The bridge was built in 1911. The height limit is around 14', I drive over it several times a day and I never look at it anymore. The far side of the bridge turns to the north at about 90 degrees just out of view in the pics. The near side has a T intersection,with a traffic light or two, just before the gate. I have a few pics taken from either end with my digital camera. I'll go dig them up. I have been having problems posting pics here, so I may have to post them on my Railfan Pictures website.
"Keep on Trucking by Train"
"Your freight goes great with Great Northern."Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
www.sacramentolocomotiveworks.comBringing 1940s Southern Pacific to the digital age.

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Just checked my specs on that 4 panel design. Looks like a 140ft span. Still need dimensions if available. Otherwise, I think that the pics will supply enough basic info on the span.Using my parts kit this is what the SRV Bridge Works came up with.SRV Ron

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Ron
Dave is going to have answer your questions. I shot the pictures but I don't have any dimensions.
Cal Rasmussen
Beaverton, ORColumbia Gorge Route -- 20%
Old McDonalds -- Building done, Sign in progress.

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Thanks Cal, I'll wait for his reply. If he doesn't have the info, I can put the bridges together with the info of the photos and sizes from existing spans.The test span posted took less then an hour to assemble and adjust to a twin track. It measures 140ft length, 30ft deck width, 30ft from girder base to top of girder. U.S. bridges are measured in feet.From what I can see from the three photos posted, there is a 4 panel span, the swing span, a 6 panel span, and a span - possible 4 panel - in the far end.Past 10pm already. I'll check for post in the morning.SRV Ron

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Here's a pic I found last week. It must have been taken some time before all the paint turned orange... Damn sun !
(Wp713)

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Thanks million cal, I have to make a trip to "Sacratomato" this week, so ill go to the calif rail museum library and look up the plans,(I would order copies of the plans, but funds this month are real scarce) and get some dimensions to help put it together. I also will be picking up yard plans for sac yard for both 1940, and 1978 that I ordered last week(the original full size 4x5 bluprints)
progress is moving along on donner pass route, and it won't be long ill be posting some more screen shots the roseville yard is almost complete,track testing in progress,and objects being built and placed!Dave

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-22-02 AT 12:42 PM (EDT)

Hey Dave,
I don't know what the museum has in their library, but if you have the time, could you see if they have any information on a couple of bridges for me. I am looking for details on The Dalles Bridge which crosses the Columbia just downstream from the dam, the Hood River bridge and the Bridge of the Gods. All theses bridges span the Columbia River and all three are vehicular bridges (no tracks).I would be happy to reimburse you for any expenses. Thanks. (edit): You mentioned ordering plans for bridges. What is your source? Do they have plans for all of the US or is it limited to California?Cal Rasmussen
Beaverton, ORColumbia Gorge Route -- 20%
Old McDonalds -- Building done, Sign in progress.

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This wouldn't happen to be that bridge in the background, I don't reminder going over to many bridges between SAC-OKJ.Thanks

Brian E. Bundridge
Founder - Evergreen Tracks
Seattle, Washington

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-22-02 AT 01:22 PM (EDT)

That would be the same bridge, a view of the east end. Just out of site on the far end of the bridge are 2 signals, 1 is standard size and the other is a dwarf. On the road portion, you can see the T intersection and traffic lights I mentioned above. The bridge that is above the Amtrak engines is I-5.
Cal, I go to the CSRM library every other weekend and will be going next Saturday. Here is the link for their data base,http://www.csrmf.org/doc.asp?id=14 If you search there and find something, let me know the numbers, filing location, document type, company name, and description."Keep on Trucking by Train"
"Your freight goes great with Great Northern."Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
www.sacramentolocomotiveworks.comBringing 1940s Southern Pacific to the digital age.

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SRV Bridge works is going to be down for a while until I get some rest.Was up most of the night babysitting an old sick pony that had a very bad night. Ended up calling the vet at 5:30am to come out and put her down. Just got back online to check things out after digging a hole all morning to bury her. Waiting for it to quit raining so I can finish filling it in. She was 40, a matter of time before I was going to have to do this.Pictures look good. This will provide a lot more info for modeling the bridges. Looks like a very complex approach for the highway thats above this bridge and rail line.SRV Ron

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I did a search of the website and didn't find anything on the three bridges. I suspect that the Multnomah County Library in downtown Portland will be my best resource. They have a tremendous collection of documents on the Columbia River Gorge.
Cal Rasmussen
Beaverton, ORColumbia Gorge Route -- 20%
Old McDonalds -- Building done, Sign in progress.

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FYI If you can't find the plans I did a little scaling off an aerial photo:Width - 11 or 12 meters
Swing span length - 115m
East approach span - 30m?
West approach span - 115m?The approach spans are a little tough to call cause I can't tell where the rr span ends & just the hwy span begins.Scale 1m=1pixel

JohnCS
dem_ex@hotmail.com
visit the DEMEX website:
http://www.dem-ex.com

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The overhead shows the layout of the road over the tracks quite well.The width at 12 meters is correct for a twin track in MSTS. Lengths may be a bit short. But, as you said, it is difficult to get accurate measurments from the terraserver photo. Also, there are short spans on each end carrying the road over the rails.Originally started the East span at 120ft since it looks like 45* bracing, but, it wasn't tall enough at that length. (Grand Trunk span of similar design measured 140ft.)Did some work of additional textures using the pics posted for the top lattacework unique to this bridge. I may model the swing span sometime this week and post a screen shot for evaluation.SRV Ron

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-23-02 AT 11:53 PM (EDT)

Ron
I will take the digital to work tomorrow and take a few pics from the north side of the bridge as well as a few from the road portion. Maybe I will get lucky and it will be open(I never considered myself lucky to be there when it is open). Here are a few pics I took last week.
"Keep on Trucking by Train"
"Your freight goes great with Great Northern."Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
www.sacramentolocomotiveworks.comBringing 1940s Southern Pacific to the digital age.

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Also seeing how we are bridges, there is this one a few miles east of the I street bridge. This one is over the American River.
"Keep on Trucking by Train"
"Your freight goes great with Great Northern."Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
www.sacramentolocomotiveworks.comBringing 1940s Southern Pacific to the digital age.

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Looks like that one is skewed to fit parallel to the river. I have a similar one in the bridge replacement upload.I an saving all the posted pics for reference. I may do a railing texture to match that on this bridge to go with the custom lattacework texture.SRV Ron

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-25-02 AT 05:09 PM (EDT)

Swing span length is 390 feet 3 inches, got that data off the sac rail yard maps I just got at the ca state rail museumDave

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Thanks for the info. That will give me something to work out the other dimensions.Heading off to a computer meeting I've missed the past several months due to work and caring for the old pony. (There's now four of them buried out back, no more left.)I will work on the swing span in a day or two and post the results for evaluation.SRV Ron

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Total span of river crossing is 853feet,5inches Backwall to backwall(Sac River retaining walls)
Dave

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-25-02 AT 10:39 PM (EDT)

Ok, Here are some more pics I got today
1) heading southbound towards the bridge
2) nearing the "T" intersection
3) sitting at light, view of North side of bridge
4) crossing the bridge
5) approaching 90 degree corner on west end of bridge
6) close up of west end of bridge Need to recharge camera.
You can not see it, but on the center of the bridge to the left of the height sign is a placque with the date of 1911. The height limit is 14'11".
"Keep on Trucking by Train"
"Your freight goes great with Great Northern."Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
www.sacramentolocomotiveworks.comBringing the steam engine to the digital age.

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Those folks behind you must have been cursing at you while you casually took those pics.Seems like a REAL tight upper deck!
Glad I done have to go over that in my travels (so far).Martyn T. Griffin
griffinmt@mindspring.com

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-26-02 AT 09:27 PM (EDT)

390ft makes the two approach spans 195ft and 130 ft. This does not include the elevated roadway. And, the width of the road on the deck - 20ft + 5 ft sidewalk on each side + railing.Posted pic is upgraded and adjusted to 130ft one of the approach spans. Created another custom texture for the road and railing.Thanks for the infoSRV Ron

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-26-02 AT 10:31 PM (EDT)

According to the map I have, the east side approach is 114'9 1/2" to face of back wall. This map doesnt give any specs on the west side, as it is a map of the yard as it was in 1940, but it does give the total span, the sing span, and the eastern approaches.
Whats funny, is i bought 2 maps, one circa 1940, the other was the lastest map the sac rail museum had available and its from the late 70's, my guess is 1978, or 1979. and the later map gives absolutely no info on the bridge, it ends right at the approach span! Man do I wish that msts would allow a working round hose, the 1940 map has an awsome turntable and round house!Dave

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Ron,
Looks good, I was wondering how I was going to build this bridge for our Oakland to Sacramento 1940s route. Are you going to attempt the road approaches as well? If you are, I can go get some more pics of the layout of the road.
"Keep on Trucking by Train"
"Your freight goes great with Great Northern."Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
www.sacramentolocomotiveworks.comBringing 1940s Southern Pacific to the digital age.

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Recovering from losing the old nag of 40 years Sunday. At her age, it was a matter of when. Had a 34 year old horse that had a stroke Jan 1 of this year. Equine Senior and modern vet care has sure extended the life span. Now, theres no animals to care for when I get home for the first week in 35 years. That really upsets the routine.It just means is that things are going to take longer then normal to do for a while.The one approach span and special textures are done. I will start on the swing span tonight. It will use existing parts and textures from the other bridge kits plus the two smaller special textures.I see no reason why I can't do the roads as well if the info is available.SRV Ron

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-27-02 AT 09:50 PM (EDT)

Ron, I appologize for not sending my condolences about your pony earlier, I had fully intended to. I hope all works out.
I appreciate you doing the bridge and am not expecting you to hurry up and do it.
If you can please email me at:
erik@sacramentolocomotiveworks.com EDIT: that swing span is totally awesome. I am impressed and appreciate your attention to detail.
"Keep on Trucking by Train"
"Your freight goes great with Great Northern."Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
www.sacramentolocomotiveworks.comBringing 1940s Southern Pacific tothe digital age.

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Would you believe I got a sympathy card from the vet? A day later, I got the bill. OUCH!SRV Ron

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Progress Report. Here is a pic of the 390ft swing span frame. I have yet to add the deck and control structure. Have to work Saturday so will continue Sat evening.SRV Ron

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I am impressed to see where this has gone from my initial posting of the pictures. Ron, I am particularly impressed with your work. To all who have contributed, good job. I think this is an excellent example of cooperative effort in realizing a project. Kudos to all.
Cal Rasmussen
Beaverton, ORColumbia Gorge Route -- 20%

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here is a terraserver pic

3d2369563661458f.jpg

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Took me all of five minutes to locate and save a full screen to show the intersection. I'll include some of the highway bridges when I am ready to upload. Route builders are on your own for the freeway East of the bridge.Thank you everyone who supplied the pics and other info. There are at least three route builders waiting for the finished design.SRV Ron

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LAST EDITED ON Sep-28-02 AT 08:28 PM (EDT)

Progress report as of 8:30PM. 3120 polys on the swing span with piers. Side view, train view and highway view. The road is a dumb road which is quite narrow as is the real road.I need to do the 6 panel span and then, that part is complete.SRV RonEdit to take care of uploads

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Ron-
After you leading me to this thread, I must say, you do some mighty fine work.
I do have to cuss you a bit. *^&%$$@@#%&*&^%. Now I have to find someplace on Snafu Pass for another one of your bridges. And I was getting so close to having the trackwork completed. Guess I'll have to add a couple more tiles.
HawkIt's the "Orange Blossom Special" bringing my baby home.

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Ron,
you cant even begin to know how much I appreciate you building this bridge, My route(Donner Pass) begins @ 2 miles west of the bridge, and it will be the first major Visual effect the train passes through, I already have the approaches roughed in and waiting for your finished product!
Dave

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Bridges are now complete and ready to test. I need to do the highway approaches and work out a special request with another route builder who also needs this bridge and some others.Certainly, a challanging modeling project to build something highly detailed without running into a poly count issue.Hopefully, I can wrap up this project during the weekend.SRV Ron

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