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"DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE"

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sniper297 (1722 posts)
Mar-04-02, 02:36 PM (EST) "DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" I read bits and pieces of the latest argument between route developers, until I got bored with it and went on to other things. I noticed my name was mentioned as a Judge in this, so I guess I gotta render a decision.
Personally, I get along fine with a$$holes, just by being an a$$hole right back until they mellow out. The ones I have difficulty with are the sensitive artist types, I went to a tough high school where half the student body belonged to the Spectres and the other half belonged to the Latin Kings. So having someone say something "mean" is a matter of perspective, exactly what constitutes "mean" depends on what you're used to.
As an adult, I'm now a community activist constantly locking horns with gangs and drug dealers, I get a lot of mean things said to me, primarily designed to send me a message and scare me off. Here's a message someone left on my back gate last summer that I considered to be mean:
Didn't scare me off tho, a punk that needs 4 shots from a Glock 9mm to kill a little dog from close range ain't all that scary to me. Consequently I have little sympathy for anyone who runs off the forum and hides because his feelings were hurt. Non Gratum Anum Rodentum.As someone else pointed out, it's only a game, so how important is it anyway? The other day I went to the Main building of Duke Ellington, my youngest son's school, to find that the main entrance was roped off due to icicles falling from the roof. Swell. A prefabricated temporary building over 30 years old, designed for 400 students, with 2 sets of double doors and one single door, and one of the double door sets roped off due to a hazard. So in the event of a fire, we got a total of three 36" wide doors to evacuate 600 kids from a building that was inadequately designed for 400.The branch ain't in much better shape, since it's constantly settling and shifting the classroom doors occasionally get jammed shut, and you have to push on the walls to unjam them. Each building has an "all purpose" room which serves as lunchroom, gym, music classroom,assembly hall, and storage. Both have one set of double doors and one single door. The single door in the main building's all purpose room is the one previously mentioned, goes directly outside. The single door in the branch goes thru the kitchen to get outside.So in the event of a fire in the kitchen all these (120 to 150 kids) would have to go out through one set of double doors.Don't do much for educational atmosphere either, crammed in like sardines it's hard to find a quiet place to read that's out of traffic.
Ten feet away from a busy street, the noise level through two 1/8" sheet steel panels with 2" of styrofoam between, bolted together 33 years ago to make walls, is indescribable.
I gotta be careful about leaning against these walls, if I fall out I could get hit by a bus. This classroom wasn't too bad, only 20 kids that year, and the roof never leaked except when it rained. Plenty of heat in the summer, plenty of ventilation in the winter. And the walls ARE thick enough to stop bullets.I've been working on getting these "temporary" buildings replaced with a single permanent one farther from the main street since 1995. I started out very politely and diplomatically, promises were made and broken, and I recently took the gloves off. We're currently "off the list" again even though the land is available, Paul Vallas promised me personally that groundbreaking would begin in December of 2000 (it didn't, he's not getting my vote for governor), and the plans have long since been approved and signed off. Many politicians and bureaucrats have privately said "mean" things to me along the way,and I just hit right back. Once the damn thing is built we can be civil to each other again, it's nothing personal. And I really couldn't care less who gets "credit" for it as long as it finally does get built, Paul Vallas can rename the school after himself and use it for his campaign headquarters for all I care. We got a pretty good crew of teachers for an inner-city school, and they could perform miracles if they only had a halfway decent place to do it. Anyone wants to try and run me off with my tail between my legs is welcome to take their best shot, I don't quit just because you got me down. Nil Desparandum.So. Keeping it all in perspective, how important is it, what exactly constitutes mean spirited discussion, the fact that getting credited for contributions don't actually earn you anything of significance, it is the judgement of this court that all you guys need to lighten up. Bailiff, take them all out and paint them neon-flourescent."Hangin" Judge Jim Ward
West Side,
Chicago, USA Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Table of Contents

Subject Author Message Date ID RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... roeter Mar-04-02 1 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... CSX_CW60AC_GregMarck Mar-04-02 2 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... Boweavel Mar-04-02 3 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... jfroth1 Mar-04-02 4 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... beluga Mar-04-02 6 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... Fixit Mar-04-02 5 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... Southern_Railway Mar-04-02 7 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... wp713 Mar-04-02 8 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... QueenHeartles Mar-04-02 11 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... Hobart Mar-04-02 9 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... sniper297 Mar-04-02 13 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... Hobart Mar-05-02 14 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... beluga Mar-05-02 18 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... patm41 Mar-04-02 10 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... McCloud_River_John Mar-04-02 12 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... wpfan Mar-05-02 15 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... dansherman Mar-05-02 16 RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME D... SHEPLEY1935 Mar-05-02 17

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roeter (18 posts)
Mar-04-02, 03:43 PM (EST) 1. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" I rest my case. Well done. Rob Roeterdink Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
CSX_CW60AC_GregMarck (256 posts)
Mar-04-02, 03:53 PM (EST) 2. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" out of EVERYONE on the fourm, I respect you the most. Thanks for bein a part of this hobby.Greg Marck
Act. Maker
gregoryis411@hotmail.com Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Boweavel (1513 posts)
Mar-04-02, 03:59 PM (EST) 3. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" This post (especially the dog..had dogs all my life) actually brought a tear to my eye.. But at the same time it opened my eyes..as i hope others.. That this bickering and others like it are really..end the end, pointless...Thanks for giving such a Neutral perspective.. You'd make a damn fine Judge....
Catchya Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jfroth1 (108 posts)
Mar-04-02, 05:09 PM (EST) 4. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Judge Jim,We've noted Many remarkable posts from you in the past (actually, MOST of 'em), but this one... amazing, and a page & chapter for all here to be re-read. THANK YOU, for not only the unselfish 'stuff' you do here, but for the betterment you obviously instill in everyone that comes in contact with your everyday life. Perhaps with the court's consent, you can provide the children with neon-fluorescent paint-pots & brushes and let them practice their artistry on... well, you know jfroth1
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beluga (142 posts)
Mar-04-02, 06:04 PM (EST) 6. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Freaking A right.( New York for "I agree") Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Fixit (13 posts)
Mar-04-02, 06:03 PM (EST) 5. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Hey Jim,
I thank you for your opinion on the issue. I've read he posts about it and I look forward to coming to the forum to read and get ideas about routes. It seems there are alot of people like me that read and not do too much posting. I try to get information and and help. I get a lot from here and I am so glad that there is someone here who has helped put it into perspective. I do understand where you are coming from. When you had mentioned the gang names of your HS days reminded me of where I grew up and how. I to grew up on the west side. Problably not that far from where you are at. That was at Cermak and Damen. Been a long time since I was around there. All of my family is still around Chicago and I do try to get there every couple of years.
I am not sure what the point is that I am trying to say, I guess I check got a look back into my childhood and it makes me grateful for what I have now. A wife, family, and a new house that is on the way. I guess MSTS is the one hobby that I have that I am enjoying.
Oh well, I guess that my rambling is done. I guess the main thing is Thank You for the help you have given to Everone.
Terry
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Southern_Railway (278 posts)
Mar-04-02, 06:34 PM (EST) 7. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Jim,Thanks for putting things in perspective.Bill Burnett Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
wp713 (387 posts)
Mar-04-02, 08:00 PM (EST) 8. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Funny, no reply from the debaters???
(Wp713) Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
QueenHeartles (37 posts)
Mar-04-02, 10:41 PM (EST) 11. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" no reply needed, he says it all.Queen"And the meandering of the queen continues for another day..." Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Hobart (221 posts)
Mar-04-02, 10:27 PM (EST) 9. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Right on Sniper! Your O.K., I don't care what they say about you. Some of your neighbors really really suck though. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (1722 posts)
Mar-04-02, 11:27 PM (EST) 13. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Gangbangers and drug dealers all suck. The crooked cops, crooked politicians, pig headed bureaucrats, and greedy rich people responsible for the whole mess suck even worse, especially when they pretend that everything is hunky-dory as-is status-quo, and Thine Alabaster Cities Gleam Undimmed by Human Tears.
I'm not really making my point here very well, what I'm trying to get at is that we all come from different backgrounds with different life experiences, and trying to get two people from the same family to whistle yankee doodle in time with each other is difficult, trying to get 6000 people from all over the world to communicate without ever having disagreements or misunderstandings is impossible. The point is you hash out your differences and move on, I also thought LK was an a$$hole, and even referred to him obliquely as one once (he instantly put on the shoe that I threw and announced that it fit him). Just because he's an a$$hole we can't get along? Maybe I'm more tolerant than most people because of my parents, who believed in letting the whirling dervishes whirl, and not trying to bend everyone to their own point of view. I was 14 when Dr. Martin Luther King was killed, and in the subsequent race riots I climbed out the broken window of an overturned bus and spent the next 3 hours fighting, hiding, and running from large mobs of black people through burning streets full of overturned cop cars and abandoned fire trucks. Those people were all wrong, but I didn't join the KKK or American Nazis after that because they are also wrong, for the same reason.
If Lawrence or Mark Toland or whoever comes back, I'll treat them civilly when they treat me civilly, flame them when I think they deserve it, and forgive and forget and go back to treating them civilly until the next time. Maybe that comes from working with kids in the 5 to 10 year old bracket all day, their battles tend to be short, intense, and quickly forgotten. You can learn a lot of things from kids.
Meantime I ain't perfect either, I'm gonna make mis\*.*\takes and get pissed off for no good reason, or hurt somebody without intending to. The only perfect human being in history wasn't really human, only half human on his mother's side, and they nailed him to a cross for it. And again, if I wanted fame and glory I'd learn the guitar and be a rock star, I do everything I do for my own selfish greedy reasons, namely that I've learned that I always get more back than I give, one way or another. If that new school ever does get built it'll be too late to benefit me, my youngest will be graduating next year to a different school. But when it does get built, I will feel a sense of pride when I see it, even if nobody else on the whole planet knows I was partially responsible, or even knows my name. I still get a kick out of these screenshots;
http://www.trainartisan.com/010102.htm
even tho my name isn't mentioned anywhere. Who cares, it looks good! Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Hobart (221 posts)
Mar-05-02, 01:34 AM (EST) 14. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" LAST EDITED ON Mar-05-02 AT 01:37 AM (EST)
>greedy rich people responsible for the whole mess suck even worse.You be a readin my mind boss. Lets say your neighbor, the one
that sucks, robs a liquor store. They slam the door on that f*&k
for 25 to life.(rightly so in my book) Can't wait to see what the real criminals get for the little game of 3 card monty Enron style. What do you figure probation and community service? >I'd learn the guitar and be a rock starThats the way you do it, ya learn to play da gitar on the MTV Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
beluga (142 posts)
Mar-05-02, 03:21 PM (EST) 18. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Trainartisan.com must be very busy not to take the time to put your name under the photos. The should use a little of their spit and polish on recognizing you for the terrain and textures.
I like the 3D Trains F-units better anyway. And I not plugging them, I bought an F set and am happy with it, But they do not answer e-mail. Just felt like taking a shot. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
patm41 (668 posts)
Mar-04-02, 10:38 PM (EST) 10. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE"
Judge Sniper,, I know what you mean , (Not having to to with the debates here) Years ago when i lived across town , I kid you not,When I took the trash out to the alley way at night I would always pack my S&W m 29 .44 mag ... I have had the same kinda things happen in the hood!! patm41
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McCloud_River_John (171 posts)
Mar-04-02, 10:54 PM (EST) 12. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Jim, I could not agree more! Sometimes we blow things way too big, or our lives are too simple I guess. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
wpfan (224 posts)
Mar-05-02, 02:26 AM (EST) 15. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" On the topic of drug dealers I think George Carlin has made the most since. When talking about extending the death penalty to drug dealers he said, it won't work because the drug dealers aren't afraid to die, they're out there in the street everyday fighting for territory. The death penalty would only work on people afraid to die, like the bankers who launder the drug money. Execute a few bankers and the drug trade would dry up so fast one wouldn't even be able to buy drugs in schools are prisons anymore.That has been paraphrased to keep it short but the idea is got. I think that the drug trade can only exist with crooked cops, politicians, and of course the money men.However this thread isn't truly about drugs, but people who can't view things in true perspective. I sit down to check out the forums, and to mess with MSTS, PSP, and TSM at the end of the day to unwind not to wind back up. If I see someone use one of my freight cars, I think it is great, it tells me that my work must be decent if somebody uses it. This is just a game, if somebody uses something of mine, while I would like to recieve proper credit, the world is not going to come to an end, after all this is supposed to be a hobby, or did I miss something.I guess once again it took the Sniper to put things in true perspective.The voice of insanity in a seemingly normal world. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
dansherman (40 posts)
Mar-05-02, 11:07 AM (EST) 16. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" >On the topic of drug dealers
>I think George Carlin has
>made the most since.
>When talking about extending the
>death penalty to drug dealers
>he said, it won't work
>because the drug dealers aren't
>afraid to die, they're out
>there in the street everyday
>fighting for territory. The
>death penalty would only work
>on people afraid to die,
>like the bankers who launder
>the drug money. Execute
>a few bankers and the
>drug trade would dry up
>so fast one wouldn't even
>be able to buy drugs
>in schools are prisons anymore.
>
>
>That has been paraphrased to keep
>it short but the idea
>is got. I think
>that the drug trade can
>only exist with crooked cops,
>politicians, and of course the
>money men.
>
>However this thread isn't truly about
>drugs, but people who can't
>view things in true perspective.
> I sit down to
>check out the forums, and
>to mess with MSTS, PSP,
>and TSM at the end
>of the day to unwind
>not to wind back up.
> If I see someone
>use one of my freight
>cars, I think it is
>great, it tells me that
>my work must be decent
>if somebody uses it.
>This is just a game,
>if somebody uses something of
>mine, while I would like
>to recieve proper credit, the
>world is not going to
>come to an end, after
>all this is supposed to
>be a hobby, or did
>I miss something.
>
>I guess once again it took
>the Sniper to put things
>in true perspective.
>
>The voice of insanity in a
>seemingly normal world. Although I seldom disagree with one of my heroes, I have to in this case. If ALL drug dealers get put to death, you will eventually run out of drug dealers. Its sorta like having a bushel of apples, some of which are spoiled. If you eliminate the spoiled ones, they won't contaminate the good ones. And now back to our regularly scheduled program. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
SHEPLEY1935 (232 posts)
Mar-05-02, 11:20 AM (EST) 17. "RE: DEBATE VS. DISPUTE: HEAH COME DE JUDGE" Jim,
Although we have never met and broken bread I am so very glad that you have become a part of my little world! As I grow older and more infirm and grumpier your thoughts and words bring me solace in knowing that, in little ways, I have been able to help a few people in a positive way. Most of us have been able to help and the way we were raised it was just a part of our lives!
Your Friend from Oak Park,
Don Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

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