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Hi,I'm experimenting with Xtracks 3.10 on LGVMed and here is my problem with 6000 m radius curves:This does not occur with 4000 or 8000 m radius curves. Is there a way to fix this?Thanks, Luchttp://perso.wanadoo.fr/lucweb/lgvmed/eng/default.htm
Unfortunately not an easy way and it is because of a misstake when first defining those sections in the tsection.dat (I did not do that). The 4000 & 8000 are defined as a number of shorter segments no more than 1d each (5x1d = 5d aso). The 6000 is defined as one 5d segment. This is what effects the catenary. Changing this in the tsection.dat disturbes routes that use those sections.
Okrasa,Thanks for your reply.It's not a big issue anyway because where a 6000 m radius curve is, a 4000 m can fit with the appropriate straight sections added. I'm currently making an Excel spreadsheet which will indicate the exact length of the straight sections to add/remove in many configurations of curves replacement.If I remember well, 4000 m is the minimum required radius for LGVs (for 300-350 km/h speeds), so this is not really a problem, even on prototypical high speed routes.Thanks again, Luchttp://perso.wanadoo.fr/lucweb/lgvmed/eng/default.htm
Hi Luc,I'm afraid to tell you that in compliance to european law the maximum banking of curves is restricted to 160mm ( 6 1/3 Inch ). Assuming this and in addition an allowed lack of additional 100mm (~ 4 in.) banking will result in a radius of 4085m for 300Km/h and 5560 for 350km/h. An unbanked curve, again allowing the lack of max 100mm banking needs to have a radius of 10620m for 300km/h and 14455 for 350km/h.Regards Roman
Hi Roman,Many thanks for reminding us of the precise numbers, however let's see what can be done from the MSTS route builder perspective. Here is a real case I'm working on:On LGVMed, just after Aix-en-Provence, we have the following curves:5800 radius, 25° right 11500 radius, 10° right 4600 radius, 80° left(actual values are rounded and take into account slope variations)How can we model this in MSTS with Xtracks?Even if the 6000 m curve didn't have the catenary problem, it will never fit in the space used by the 5800 m radius curve (although it's close, the tracks will never connect, even if tracks are separated by a few meters, or even centimeters). Lowering the radius of a curve is feasible by adding appropriate straight sections, but the opposite is not (this would modify the layout of the entire route, you would have to move mountains, etc).So, the only solution we have is to replace the 5800 m radius curve by a 4000 m one.Same thing for the others: 11500 -> 8000, 4600 -> 4000.Please note that, although this may seem very restrictive, this is a huge improvement over the current layout which uses only 2000 m radius curves, maximum radius allowed by standard MSTS track sections.About banking, I was dreaming it was implemented in MSTS2, but well... everyone knows the story. This would have been great on LGVMed (see the intro photo, done by me at 300 km/h in the 4600 m curve I'm speaking about). Maybe you can compute the value by measuring the angle of the gantries.Luchttp://perso.wanadoo.fr/lucweb/lgvmed/eng/default.htm
You could even mix shorter curve segments below and above the wanted radius to avoid using straights in the middle of the curves. Say you need a 5000r then you use a mixture of 4000r and 6000r to approximate a 5000r. With short segments users would need to go into RE and select the tracks to be able to tell the differens. Don't know if SNCF uses easments into those curves but then it would be even more prototypical using a mixture of shorter segments with the higher radius ones at the ends of the curve.
..'Don't know if SNCF uses easments into those curves ..' Yes they do, but it is almost impossible to detect them without instruments. They use spirals to limit the horizontal force under a comparable very low limit. The spirals are very long but the horizontal offset is small. Inside stations that horizontal shock-limit has a value of 100, on highspeed tracks it must be below 20. In stations the limit is usually given by the comfort offered to passengers, outside on the highspeed tracks the limit is forced by the titanic forces on the wheel-flanges at that speed.Roman
This does not occur with 4000 or 8000 m radius curves.
Luc