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Colin (9 posts)
Aug-11-01, 12:36 PM (EST) "Ogden & Northern Route" As requested Jim, here is the problem I’ve encountered. I downloaded the route, but when trying to run it crashes as I approach the switch after leaving Coal City. On rebooting when I try to load O & N again I get “No extended data” and “failed to open” error messages. Regardless of a yes or no answer to the “Want to continue” message, it eventually crashes before loading fully. On rebooting again O & N will start, but I can’t get past that switch. Haven’t tried starting from another location yet, though. I am running a Pentium III 6000 with a Nvidia TNT2 Pro card and 128megs memory.Map looks cool so it would be great to develop activities for it.Colin
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Subject Author Message Date ID RE: Ogden & Northern Route LocoRo Aug-11-01 1 RE: Ogden & Northern Route LocoRo Aug-11-01 2 RE: Ogden & Northern Route KCSrail Aug-11-01 3 RE: Ogden & Northern Route Familton Aug-11-01 4 RE: Ogden & Northern Route ejoiner Aug-11-01 5 RE: Ogden & Northern Route LocoRo Aug-11-01 7 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-11-01 11 RE: Ogden & Northern Route rrfoose Aug-11-01 6 RE: Ogden & Northern Route samschul Aug-11-01 8 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-12-01 15 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-11-01 10 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-11-01 9 RE: Ogden & Northern Route Gandalf Aug-11-01 12 RE: Ogden & Northern Route sniper297 Aug-12-01 13 RE: Ogden & Northern Route Familton Aug-12-01 14 RE: Ogden & Northern Route samschul Aug-13-01 29 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-12-01 16 RE: Ogden & Northern Route sniper297 Aug-12-01 17 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-12-01 18 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-12-01 19 RE: Ogden & Northern Route Gandalf Aug-12-01 20 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-12-01 24 RE: Ogden & Northern Route Familton Aug-12-01 28 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-14-01 31 RE: Ogden & Northern Route PcKiller Aug-12-01 21 RE: Ogden & Northern Route sniper297 Aug-12-01 22 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-12-01 23 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-12-01 25 RE: Ogden & Northern Route LocoRo Aug-12-01 26 RE: Ogden & Northern Route scand Aug-12-01 27 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-14-01 30 RE: Ogden & Northern Route sniper297 Aug-14-01 32 RE: Ogden & Northern Route jkcooney Aug-15-01 33

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LocoRo (83 posts)
Aug-11-01, 12:41 PM (EST) 1. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Yes same situation overhere.. i am trying now the AUTUMN*.* = AUTUMN\*.* solution.. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
LocoRo (83 posts)
Aug-11-01, 12:58 PM (EST) 2. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" >Yes same situation overhere..
>
>i am trying now the AUTUMN*.*
>= AUTUMN\*.* solution..
Nope didnt help at all..i get OE-mistakes to see Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
KCSrail (20 posts)
Aug-11-01, 01:10 PM (EST) 3. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Yes, having the same problems
Rich Bohlman - Pearl, Mississippi Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Familton (176 posts)
Aug-11-01, 03:01 PM (EST) 4. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" I modified EZStuff and added the missing \'s to all of the lines that ended as *.*. Each line end should say \*.* not *.*. It worked fine when I used EZStuff to add the files. It's not only the AUTUMN lines. There are others that have the missing \. Regards, Bob. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
ejoiner (155 posts)
Aug-11-01, 03:20 PM (EST) 5. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Thats true. I found out about the WINTER*.* problem...needs
to be fixed as WINTER\*.*I stil have the problem though. I just deleted this route til
Sniper gets it worked out. Too much stuff on this PC to risk
hard crashes.Eric Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
LocoRo (83 posts)
Aug-11-01, 03:50 PM (EST) 7. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" >Thats true. I found out
>about the WINTER*.* problem...needs
>to be fixed as WINTER\*.*
>
>I stil have the problem though.
> I just deleted this
>route til
>Sniper gets it worked out.
>Too much stuff on this
>PC to risk
>hard crashes.
>
>Eric Yes i also wait for the fix. I just deleted the route. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-11-01, 09:07 PM (EST) 11. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" I agree..... the route looks great but I'll let the trouble shooters do their thing......don't want to risk any problems. I'm having enough trouble trying to find an easy install for the new Searchlight signaling system. I understand you must delete all existing signals and replace them with the Searchlights one by one.....ouch!
Joe Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
rrfoose (14 posts)
Aug-11-01, 03:37 PM (EST) 6. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Try copying the Textures and Shapes folders from Europe 2. That fixed the problem for me.
Chase Zickefoose
Foose
rrfoose@aol.com Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
samschul (17 posts)
Aug-11-01, 08:37 PM (EST) 8. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Copying the texture and shape files from Europe2 fixed it for me also. This route is a real HOOT!!!. I have been thinking so much about modeling a real route, I did not even think that a route from Model railroads would be so much fun. Keep up the great work.Sam Schulenburg Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-12-01, 10:05 AM (EST) 15. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Are the texture and shape files ONLY the "sd" and "s" files? I did that and got the route to load and it will allow me to run only a little and then I get derails and weird engine uncouplings for no logical reason..........do I need to copy more files other than the sd and s files?
Joe Cooney
PS.....I agree the route looks great.....heading out on the that trestle over the River at Port Ogden is scarey......I'd like to try it without all the derail problems I'm having!
Joe Cooney, Ocala, FL
Do you think it's just a bad download??? Should I try, try again with a clean download......I'd love to add the new searchlight signals to this route since its "clean" and I wouldn't have the nightmare of deleting all existing signals as I have now on Marias Pass! Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-11-01, 09:04 PM (EST) 10. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Have you had weird derail and locomotive reversal problems. Here's one I experienced today... 2 GP-38s leaving coal city headed for the loop and Johnsburg on the left leg of the Wye track the two locomotives uncoupled and my lead loco was headed straight toward the loco that used to be coupled to it.....it was on the track directly ahead of me!!! Whasup?
Joe Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-11-01, 09:01 PM (EST) 9. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" I've had the same problem... if you ride the front of the locomotive you will notice a piece of rail literally disappears while the locomotive is runinning over it... the ties and plates remain in place but the rail disappears. Also, on the loop from Coal City down to Johnsburg whenever the rail changes from dynamic to a fixed section (or vice versa) the locomotives uncouple and switch places while derailing as well. Weird. But, I'm sure this will be ironed out and I agree with you that this is intriguing. Once I reloaded all the Europe 2 files so the shapes and bridges were recognized by the program...
Joe Cooney. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Gandalf (27 posts)
Aug-11-01, 11:41 PM (EST) 12. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" You're talking about the wye at Coal City, right? Had the same problem...fought with it till 4:00 am and went to bed frustrated. Today I tried copying the texture and shape files from Europe2 into their respective Ogden folders one more time...and it worked!!! Been running all day with no problems. What a great route. The funny thing is I had seriously thought about breaking out my old copy of "101 PLans" just for the sheer fun of creating one of those layouts no one ever could possibly build...maybe I still will(if I can get a lot better with The Editor, that is!). Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (177 posts)
Aug-12-01, 00:08 AM (EST) 13. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" LAST EDITED ON Aug-12-01 AT 00:20 AM (EST)Posted an update on the MSTS forum, I'll repeat it here so you guys don't have to hunt:
Port Ogden and Northern - progress report. Or maybe I should say lack of progress. I uploaded gitstufd.zip a few minutes ago, with stuffit2.bat and ezstuff2.bat, with all the typos fixed in both. Anyone still having problems with the install for Port Ogden and Northern can download the zip, and paste either one of the batch files into the root of Port_Ogden and run it. This will increase the finished install size to 441 megabytes, so you guys with the old 2 gig hard disks who are pressed for space are going to have to wait until I can figure out what the problem is. Again, the only difference between the two is that EZstuff2 is primarily meant to be used as a template for a customizable install batch file for distribution with homegrown routes, and contains an IFEXIST error switch to check for the presence of train.exe two directorys up, making it next to impossible to run it anywhere other than in a route. Be advised, if you paste it into one of the existing routes, it WILL find Train.exe two directorys up and happily copy 438 megabytes into that folder. My mistake (other than the typos) was trying to customize it too much to get the final installed size of the route down to a reasonable size. My son is visiting his mother this weekend, so I took his computer apart, pulled the ram out and put in an old stick of 32 mb pc-66 ram, and reset the jumpers on the motherboard to UNDERclock it to 350 mhz, but still couldn't duplicate the problem, so I gave up going at it from that angle, and I'm making a list of everything that I used in the route to try to get a workable install bat that will keep the size down to 200 mb, or preferably less. Until then, run ezstuff on it and let me know if you have any other problems.Jim Ward I'm really glad YOU guys like it so much, it means a lot coming from my fellow route developers. I haven't seen the derailing or dissapearing track problem, but I'll look for it. There is a hell of a big "stuttering" point coming out of Coal City (made these names up at the last minute) on the approach track to the Wye, might have something to do with it. Don't have any clue why ELSE the framerate would drop so sharply there, only 100 objects on that entire quad! Also, if any of you guys want to pake around in there in the route editor, you would have to copy all the files referenced by comboref, because ogden.ref is comboref renamed (started the route before all objects came out) and if you don't put all the shapes and textures in there the route editor gives you a bunch of "missing" errors. Apparently the route editor searches the ref file when it starts, then looks for all the entries in the subdirectorys. The game engine accesses the files in the \world directory for shapes and textures, so it only looks for the ones that are actually in the route. Speaking of which, the one time I was able to duplicate the problem one of the missing things was a yard marker, and I don't remember putting any yard markers in, so if one of you guys finds one let me know where it is. And oh yeah I forgot to lower the speed limit to 50 so the trains WOULD derail in the appropriate spots at high speed, so you guys who are having the trouble could try resetting the speed to a higher number. Also, it's possible you guys with the dissapearing track got a bad install or something, and if reinstalling and using one of the new stuffer files doesn't fix it, you could also try deleting the .tdb file and opening it up in the editor and forcing the rebuild track database program. somebody who is having the problem try it and let me know if it works. (I'm assuming everybody on this forum is at least fairly adept at using the route editor, cuz I'm a slower learner than most. I did't even know that the speed limit affected derailments directly until Chris Cyko told me! I couldn't figure that out!)
thanks again, guys. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Familton (176 posts)
Aug-12-01, 00:47 AM (EST) 14. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" I don't have any problems except as follows: I ran the Lumber Activity and when you get to the end of the line above Coal City the consist is too long to back into the switch to Coal City. I split the consist into sections and shuttled them back into Coal City then went back to pickup the other cars. When I got them all into Coal City I noticed that the full cars were split with the empties. What is the proper way to shuttle them into Coal City? I really like this route.I got an error that I didn't stop at two stations. I thought once you picked up the empties and the full cars that all you had to do was drop them at Coal City. Is this correct? Thanks, best regards, Bob. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
samschul (17 posts)
Aug-13-01, 09:53 PM (EST) 29. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Jim;
I am enjoying your route very much. I thought I had a copy of 101 trackplans, but was mistaken. I believe that it is no longer being published by Klambach. Could you post a jpeg of the original plan. I would like to compare the original with the finished, to gleen the decisions that you made in converting it to MSTS. Sam Schulenburg. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-12-01, 10:12 AM (EST) 16. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Are the "texture" and "shape" files you mentioned just the sd and s files or are there more to be copied into the route. It loads up and I can run briefly, but then I get derails on the wye at coal city and on the loop (even at 15 mph).
Joe Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (177 posts)
Aug-12-01, 12:08 PM (EST) 17. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Familton:
I created those activities just as a starter, so people who can't use the activity editor could run the route. If you can use the activity editor, go ahead and hack away. But notice that there are no popups in those activities, they're strictly open-ended, and you can make up your own work order and YOU be the one to decide if you succeeded or not.jkcooney:
Try deleting the PortOgden.tdb file in the root, open up the route in the route editor, and select the advanced, rebuild track database to see if that fixes it.
Any of you guys live in Chicago or near west suburbs? I'd like to get together with som other route developers so we could test our routes on each other's systems before uploading. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-12-01, 12:15 PM (EST) 18. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Jim.....Thanks, I'll try this. Hopefully, deleting the tdb file in the "Root directory" for your sim won't corrupt anything. I just tried three times to come down with the Lumber activity and each time I derailed approaching Northland Grain #2. It seems as if when you changed from a fixed section of trackage to a dynamic section (this is visible at really slow speeds by the dark section inside each rail and the slightly more fuzzy trackbed) this is where the problem is happening at each derail location. Also, I do notice the stutter and hesitation where the engine and graphics don't seem to want to advance and I get a replay about 4 or 5 times until the scene Jumps forward to where I would have been had the graphics not repeated. I understand this is a kinda BETA but it is still great fun!
Joe Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-12-01, 12:25 PM (EST) 19. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" How do I open up the "Advanced" setting in the Route Editor you mentioned to rebuild the track data base? Won't deleting the .tdb file first remove a reference the program needs to rebuild? Or am I being too logical. Anyway, thanks for the help I will try to rebuild the tdb if I only know how to get at the rebuild function in the editor!
Joe Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Gandalf (27 posts)
Aug-12-01, 12:56 PM (EST) 20. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" It's under the drop down on the bottom of the first box (I think "select Route") after you start the Route Editor. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-12-01, 05:06 PM (EST) 24. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Thanks for pointing me in the right direction. That was my last resort...but instead I simply downloaded and started from scratch with a fresh program. Transfered all the texture and shape folders from Europe2 and it works like a charm. Some really tight kinky track in spots but that is so typical for a heavy industrial freight line I don't mind it a bit. Those new searchlight signals would look great on this line. Have to give it a go!
Joe Cooney, Ocala, FL Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Familton (176 posts)
Aug-12-01, 09:04 PM (EST) 28. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Hi. Thanks. I was wondering what was supposed to happen. I'll try the editor. I love the route! Thanks and best regards, Bob. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-14-01, 04:10 PM (EST) 31. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Jim everything is working fine now except, of course, for the missing textures in winter and autumn but I'm not too concerned about that. One question, your work on this has actually got me interested to trying a track plan for myself. In the techdoc tutorial it has a section "Where to start AFTER extracting your terrain tiles". How do I begin CLEAN with a flat terrain since the Route Ediotr assumes you have the based tiles already extracted. How do I start by extracting them? Do I use a pre-existing route? Please advise and thanks for this great route. Your work makes this thing a pleasure!
Joe Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
PcKiller (13 posts)
Aug-12-01, 01:01 PM (EST) 21. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Thanks for the route that you made! I love the way it looks. The fix was easy too, just copy/paste the shapes and textures from the Europe to your files and overwrite. Love that long walk on short piers. Once again, Thanks. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (177 posts)
Aug-12-01, 02:37 PM (EST) 22. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Yeah, to rebuild the track database CORRECTLY you need to force the function to actually rebuild it. As near as I can figure, if you don't delete whatever.tdb and, if present, the .bk file that the route editor sometimes makes as a backup, the doggone thing trys to take a shortcut. So open up the route editor, select port ogden, and click on the advanced button, check the box for rebuild track database. If it works correctly, you should see a camera view flying around at warp 8, and a message "all world tiles visited." After that it writes a new .tdb file in the root. If it DON'T work for some reason, you can tryunzipping again. Nice thing about downloads, if you don't have a corrupted copy because of #@^$&%&%*! unreliable network servers like earthlink, you always have a zipped backup on your disk. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-12-01, 05:03 PM (EST) 23. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Jim, I just reloaded the whole program from scratch. Copied and pasted all shape and texture files from Europe2 into PortOgden and everything works like a charm. Glad I didn't have to mess with the tdb files. I guess I just had a faulty download or a quirky read on the diskdrive when I installed. In any event it runs beautifully now. Some tight track in spots but this is an industrial line and that is to be expected...especially at the Johnsburg end of Switchback bridge.....wow is that tight. I don't think I'd like to try any 6 axle or 8 axle locos on that stretch of track. By the way, in Johnsburg there is a beautiful brick building located near the inner most stub end siding away from the mainline. What is that building filed under.....it is beautiful and almost an exact replica of a building I could identify in my old home town in New York!!!!! Just curious. Thanks for a great sim. I'm sure the tunnels being set too low will be corrected... I don't think I want to mess with them... I understand that if you hold down the "H" key while you are placing these objects they will automatically locate at the correct ground level for the location. Is that correct in your experience with the Route Editor???
Thanks again.......All is well! I am enjoying the switching runs immensely. And that grade up out of the Coal Mine is murder!
Joe Cooney, Ocala, FL Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-12-01, 05:09 PM (EST) 25. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" As noted I tried a fresh download, install and it now workd beautifully.....think I'll try the new searchlight signals on your route since it is now "dark" and I won't have to remove all previously installed signalling to attempt this. Thanks again.
Joe Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
LocoRo (83 posts)
Aug-12-01, 05:42 PM (EST) 26. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Same here.. the route works thanks for the tips !!Its very nice , sniper .. thnx greetings Roland Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
scand (75 posts)
Aug-12-01, 09:00 PM (EST) 27. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Here is an easier way of installing.
Disregard the "install bat". Unzipthe files to the drive where MSTS is located. Then unzip the stufit.zip into the the route directory.
For future installations of routes that lack files, copy and paste the unzipped "stufit" bat file into the new route directory.
BTW the above route is excellent and is a "paradise" for future Activites.
Thanks! Job well done.BTW in case a new Program Files directory is created with the files within the main route Directory, just click and move the route to the main Route directory and them delete all the empty directories through the "new" Program File Directory. Sounds confusing but it has happened to me several times with trainsim downloads.Alex
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jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-14-01, 04:03 PM (EST) 30. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" Watch out for those sharp rail sections.....especially on the switchback! If you want to try something neat, try adding some of the newly available searchlight signals to this route. It's fun and helpful since the signals show up on the Track Monitor to help clue you in to where you are. And, since the route was dark (unsignaled) to begin with you won't have to delete anything. I don't know if you're big on signaling but these definitely do make an difference in enjoyable operation.
Joe Cooney
J. Cooney Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
sniper297 (177 posts)
Aug-14-01, 08:40 PM (EST) 32. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" I just uploaded version 2, with the bugs fixed in the install, and the most severe stutter problems eliminated, coal city nuked and replaced with one that doesn't have a bug factory in it. I'm curious about these signals, tho, I didn't fool around with them because they don't work the way block signals are supposed to - if you stop and back up, the signal BEHIND you is red for the block behind you, but it's red for you too, which shouldn't be unless there was another train following you currently in that block. Did somebody figure that out and fix it? Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
jkcooney (347 posts)
Aug-15-01, 10:55 AM (EST) 33. "RE: Ogden & Northern Route" I didn't encounter that particular problem but I have installed the searchlights at key control points only. The wye off the loop leading either to Johnsburg station or to Port Ogden (Johnsburg is designated as the main and is the top mast - it does show Green when the switch is set for Johnsburg station). there is some quirkiness with some locations because of the number of wye tracks in your plan. Essentially the signals recognize that the track turns back on itself (reversing loop style). But try tinkering with the "location" where you "place" the signals and I think you'll enjoy it.
Joe Cooney
jkcooney@hotmail.com Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

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