Off topic, but for anyone who cares

the following e-mail has been sent to nels and macster.
"Something needs to be done about LawrenceKellie. IMHO he is getting out of hand. he has started locking any threads that "bad mouth" or critizise him. I think he is taking advantages of his moderator privlages. please talk to him or remove his moderator privlages. I know I don't have much pull because I have only been here for a year or so. but I'm getting sick of it.
thanks for your time.
Mike"Oh and LawrenceKellie, go ahead and lock or delete this post, I got it copyed into notepad format, and I have no issue with re-posting this. and If you try to kick me our I'll contact Nels or macster and try to get back in.
signed, one irratated forum member.

Delamaize
"Long Live High Speed Rail In The USA"

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RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., JensChris, Dec-11-02, 04:15 PM, (1) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Hovertrain, Dec-11-02, 06:36 PM, (2) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Coonskin, Dec-11-02, 06:45 PM, (3) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., delamaize, Dec-11-02, 06:49 PM, (4) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Joe_Shalbotnik, Dec-13-02, 00:14 AM, (7) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Stooopid_person, Dec-13-02, 00:41 AM, (8) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., delamaize, Dec-13-02, 12:11 PM, (12) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Joe_Shalbotnik, Dec-15-02, 10:23 PM, (15) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., patm41, Dec-11-02, 08:44 PM, (5) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., OhioRailFan, Dec-12-02, 10:22 PM, (6) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Kip, Dec-13-02, 02:22 AM, (9) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., xlspecial261, Dec-13-02, 02:52 AM, (10) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., LocoRo, Dec-13-02, 05:47 AM, (11) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Kip, Dec-13-02, 03:19 PM, (13) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., CaptFuzzy4, Dec-15-02, 09:12 PM, (14) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Coonskin, Dec-15-02, 10:58 PM, (16) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Kip, Dec-15-02, 11:36 PM, (17) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Coonskin, Dec-16-02, 08:36 AM, (18) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., JensChris, Dec-20-02, 04:30 PM, (19) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., Coonskin, Dec-20-02, 04:51 PM, (20) RE: off topic, but for anyone who cares..., OhioRailFan, Dec-20-02, 09:15 PM, (21)

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LK is gone...
As is seems completely...Jens-Chris

16 years old, from Germany, MSTS 3D Add-on maker and repainter ---- Jens-Chris ----

-- "Power for You" --

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Sometimes when someone tries to enforce rules, someone who had been doing the thing that was now against the rules might have a hard time adjusting to it. But I don't have any complaint because, mainly, I don't post stuff that might get me in trouble knowingly. -Hovertrain

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That's sad news. LK may have been a bit roughshod at times, but aren't we all capable of that? The interenet can be a rough enviorn. I always found him to be helpful and very knowledgeable. Frankly, it's our loss.Andre Ming

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I'm sorry it had to come to this, but I talked to him with no results. so I took the next step. No doubt he will be missed.


Delamaize
"Long Live High Speed Rail In The USA"

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I hope you are happy. In my opinion I think the wrong person left.JS

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>In my opinion I think the wrong
>person left. Then who is the "correct" person that should leave?

------My favourite LUL train------

This is Notting Hill Gate......Change for Circle...and District lines...............This train terminates at Hainault...via Newbury Park......(Don't you just love the SONIA? If you haven't heard it, play BVE Central line to hear it!)

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I think he was refering to me, thats ok, then he cant have the K-4 when it is released. hehehe j/k


Delamaize
"Long Live High Speed Rail In The USA"

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I've seen your work, If it's anything like your T1 I won't be missing much.JS

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welcome back stranger
Patm41

Maglev Route Designer
Casino Express
Waterfront Route

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I dont' really know LK, but I did have an unpleasent experience here with him. The offense was trivial, and his approach indeed a bit less then tactful.I have been a moderator myself in the past, and I have seen moderators in action. The perception that I got was what I call the "Barney Fife Syndrom". Tho well intentioned, they set out girded with their moderator powers intent on "Cleaning up the town". Sometimes the results are not so spectacular as the intent, as they write a ticket to an old lady for jay walking, while the bank across the street is being robbed.Cheers!
Ted Thompson
Baltimore, MD

RELEASES:
EMD E/F Series semi-prototypical Cab View
Maryland Midland Railroad GP38 locomotive packCURRENT PROJECT:
B&O's Royal Blue circa 1910

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After a week of the "Lawrence Kellie issue" and making my own conclusions after reading and seeing actions on both sides, I see that human nature prevails once again. Both sides are losers...no winners. Both sides were "miffed", both sides had their say to no good end in my opinion...but at what cost?For those that have been around awhile know that LK has "personality" issues, sometimes arrogant, sometimes funny and then he's also helpful. Then you have others that are sensitive and others that are not. Put 'em all together and you get crap like this. Very sad. I have not seen a post from Lawrence since his "demise". I wonder if he'll come back. It would be a great shame if he doesn't. Perhaps he wasn't "moderator" material, but he had other gifts that he shared on occasion that were a great deal more valuable. For us route developers, his expertise in DEMEX and RE were invaluable. I wonder if that is gone now. Did all this whining about his moderator abilities cost us some "precious" knowledge for others to learn. Gosh, I hope not. But then again I wouldn't be surprised.Some of the "younger" set I can understand their reactions to LK's methods, however I was a little surprised at the older ones. I honestly beleive that the comments from the "older" set is what "banished" LK...voluntarily or not. I hope he returns...at least as a source of information. This kind of stuff is what chased off other "valuable" members and those that have been here awhile know who they are. For those that didn't want LK as a moderator, they got their wish...but at what cost.
Merry Christmas.Kip
Creator of PRRR and Hoodoo Pass...with LK's help.

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I'm with Kip on this.Although I have been here only for a short time, I have noticed occasional personality clashes such as this.We should all remember that there are thousands of people signed up to this forum. Along with them come thousands of different personalities. While it may be difficult to get along with some of the members, what purpose is served by trying to have them removed other than to satisfy your own preferences?Sometimes, it is better for the group as a whole to just bite your tongue when someones personality traits don't necessarily match up with your own.Todd Jones

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What has this topic to do with MSTS Locomotive Design ??talking about wrong persons Greetings Roland
Netherlands

fan of Christrains©
www.christrains.com

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More than you know.Kip

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>I'm with Kip on this.
>
>Although I have been here only for a short time, I have
>noticed occasional personality clashes such as this.
>
>We should all remember that there are thousands of people
>signed up to this forum. Along with them come thousands of
>different personalities. While it may be difficult to get
>along with some of the members, what purpose is served by
>trying to have them removed other than to satisfy your own
>preferences?
>
>Sometimes, it is better for the group as a whole to just
>bite your tongue when someones personality traits don't
>necessarily match up with your own.
>
>Todd Jones I couldn't agree more, Lawrence was especially of great help in getting me started in the "wonderful world or route-building". He WILL be missed.

CSX-The Spirit of West Virginia Coal.

CSX Tri-State Route-Building the Barboursville Yard. (Tricky stuff!!) Taking a break for the holidays.

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Would any of you that know it be willing to email me LK's email address to laming@clnk.comThanks.Andre

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Andre, It seems that LK totally severed his ties with the Train-Sim Community. I had 2 E-Mail addresses that no longer work and in his E-Mail via SHEPLEY in the general forum, he stated that he was going to get rid of the other E-Mails addresses he had. Apparently, if one wanted to contact him, you have to go through SHEPLEY***.These turn of events have sicken me. To lose a valuable member in this manner is an out right shame. I have lost respect for some members here. Though both parties had fault, it definitly should have been handled in a discreet manner. I am not condoning what LK did or said he did, but this really could have been avoided. Very sad....and like I said...at great cost. Folks that need DEMEX and Route info have lost a valuable resource.Kip
3DTS
The Priest River Railroad "...it's so fictional, it's almost real"
PRRR Wesite Now released: PRRR's Hoodoo Pass Route 1.5 "beta"
Coming soon: Hoodoo Pass v.2.0 "Cascadia Edition"

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Well, that's unsettling news.Is his website still open? Is there still a viable email link there?Wonder how many more we'll run off before we figure this thing out?It's way too easy to be drawn into a flame war, I've allowed it to happen to me too. But I'm beginning to see it your way: There are NO winners. Period. Deep down inside I've known this, but sometimes the prevailing "spirit" or "tone" of a forum can have detremental effects on otherwise congenial people. In my case, it shall not happen again.Time for us all to rethink the overall "tone" of this forum. We have had a good thing going here. Let's not mess in our nest.Andre Ming

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FYAI...I didn't "fire" him... I didn't do anything, but advise him not to take his job with the signatures SOOOO serious...Jens-Chris

16 years old, from Germany, MSTS 3D Add-on maker and repainter ---- Jens-Chris ----

-- "Power for You" --

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I understand Jens. Nothing in my posts in this thread have been aimed at the moderators, but mainly I've been commenting about "us", the general populace of these forums, as well as commenting about myself. Those of us that use these forums are the ones that need to take stock of what we say and how we react. It's too easy to be caustic and tacky when we begin to communicate with a phosphorus screen and forget these are real people with real feelings and in the real world face real problems... MSTS (and these forums) is one way they may use as an bit of an escape. I'm ashamed to say that I've been guilty of adding to some of the unfun experiences a couple have had here, having had a minor skirmish with them. For that I now feel regret and purpose that it will not happen again. Andre "Coonskin" Ming

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There somthing else to keep in mind, and maybe it's *very* related to the perception that some (maybe me too) have of LK.That something is that one can be caustic without EVER meaning to. The fact is, these words here are typed and as such have no face or voice to convey emotion.Consider this phrase:I hate you.Now imagine it being shouted by a 14 year old teenager who just got grounded.Now imagine it being lowly uttered by Daffy Duck after bugs get's his head blown off for the umpteenth time.Two VERY different meanings/emotions/et. al. However, typed they would both be "I hate you"Somthing to consider when typing, and an major plug for the emoticon. ^_^ =)
Cheers!
Ted Thompson
Baltimore, MD

RELEASES:
EMD E/F Series semi-prototypical Cab View
Maryland Midland Railroad GP38 locomotive packCURRENT PROJECT:
B&O's Royal Blue circa 1910

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