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wpfan (281 posts)
May-01-02, 08:48 PM (EDT) "Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" The voice of insanity in a seemingly normal world. Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
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Subject Author Message Date ID RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma wpfan May-01-02 1 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma GTJD May-02-02 2 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Cell0518 May-02-02 3 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma timken May-02-02 4 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma nw_fan May-02-02 6 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma TVRRMAN May-10-02 29 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-10-02 30 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Fastruck May-11-02 31 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Johansteam May-11-02 32 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma century242 May-02-02 5 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma timken May-02-02 7 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Hoppy504 May-03-02 8 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-03-02 9 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Hoppy504 May-03-02 10 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Andriej May-03-02 11 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-03-02 13 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-03-02 14 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Andriej May-04-02 16 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-04-02 22 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma peteK May-03-02 12 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-03-02 15 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma gokeefe May-04-02 17 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Andriej May-04-02 18 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma Andriej May-04-02 19 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma gokeefe May-04-02 20 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma peteK May-04-02 21 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-04-02 23 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma peteK May-04-02 26 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-04-02 27 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-04-02 24 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma chucksc May-04-02 25 RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma CMO May-05-02 28

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wpfan (281 posts)
May-01-02, 08:57 PM (EDT) 1. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Ok lets try actually posting something. Now that Train Artisan no longer has the ESE for free download where does one acquire the sound and cabview files from. I already have the ESE on my computer, so I am not worried about getting it. However as a steam locomotive designer what should I use for cabview and sound files now. If I didn't have TA's ESE already I would be hesitant to buy the American Classics set, sure it'll be excellent quality, but I do not wish to spend $20 on a NYC loco pack (introduce an SP GS4, MT5, and AC12 set and I'll pay $30). The ESE v2.0 cab and sound files have become the standard for American steam, now we need a replacement. Any thoughts.The voice of insanity in a seemingly normal world. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
GTJD (327 posts)
May-02-02, 01:52 PM (EDT) 2. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" the NALW Big Boy cab,perhaps? (when it's done, of course!)Uncle Charlie,
Hazzard & Southern Railways
Kanto-Johto System
Sodor & Magic Railroads Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Cell0518 (46 posts)
May-02-02, 05:34 PM (EDT) 3. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" LAST EDITED ON May-02-02 AT 05:41 PM (EDT)They even took the file download page away. ChrisCELL
Love MSTS
LOVE Train Artisan
Keep the free, good stuff comin'
Waitin' for the GS4!! Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
timken (401 posts)
May-02-02, 07:22 PM (EDT) 4. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" I'm working on custom sounds for steam. The Fozzy's D&RGW K'36 will have new sound from a K-36. As soon as the first version gets to me, I'll fine tune them. These will work for any small driver engine (44") I've done very nice sounds for the 63" driver engines, but am reworking them to slip,in sync as well. As soon as these are done I will upload them. They are big files, as they stay at 4 chugs per revolution from 1 mph to 20 pretty accurately! From here up they sound and look right, but counting revs is pretty hard! I'll do something for 77" -84" next.Figure sometime in the next two weeks (I may get sidetracked on the narrow gauge mike) for the 63" set (it is much closer than anything else available even for 55" - 70" drivered engines).I may do a custom set for the Daylight, as I have good recordings of 4449. This would include whistle and bell.Steve Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
nw_fan (308 posts)
May-02-02, 10:37 PM (EDT) 6. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" LAST EDITED ON May-02-02 AT 10:38 PM (EDT)While Steve's attention is here I have a quick (hopefully) question about chuff rate on steam locos. The W&VO 0-8-0 has a very slow chuff rate... less than one per wheel revolution. How can this be adjusted, if that is possible? I thought it involved changing a wheel radius, but was afraid that might change speed values as well.Thanks for any help
Mike
Norfolk & Western
Precision Transportation Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
TVRRMAN (9 posts)
May-10-02, 07:22 PM (EDT) 29. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Do you still need the ese cabview and sound files? If you do, I would be more than glad to zip and e-mail them to you.TVRRMAN18 Year old Avid Pennsy Fan Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
chucksc (1531 posts)
May-10-02, 11:49 PM (EDT) 30. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" It wouldn't do any good to send him the files except for his personal use as TA has prohibited their distribution with any other products than theirs...The choice you have, is to make the installation of the ESE (No longer easily available I guess) or the American Classics Set(Which is payware)a prerequisite for your Freeware engine...Basically that is the quandry we found ourselves in when TA went over to the "dark side" (LOL - Arcane Starwars Reference here! ) and the necessity to develop, from scratch, our own Steam Cabview and Sounds is what is delaying the BB and the 844 and J-C's other heavy steam projects....------Chuck Schneider---------

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Fastruck (22 posts)
May-11-02, 01:05 AM (EDT) 31. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Chuck, you are right. Why did TA go to the "dark side"?
I herd that TA are probully going to help microsoft's train sim team for MSTS2 who thought that will happen. I am not going to put these guys down but could have they of atleased left the original cab from ESE alone for free an made a better one for they'er payware.

Well ever they're Idea was it really messes with train designer such as your self and makes people who want a ese cab for their Loco they designed make their own an create a long wait time on the train simers. Sam,chuck, I am shure that you have done or are doing all research needed to do such a big task with the BB cab. I bet when the cab is done the next one will be easier on you. learn more as you go.BTW, You guys are doing a wonderful job keep it up.Fastruck
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Johansteam (164 posts)
May-11-02, 09:02 AM (EDT) 32. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" wpfan, I'm so sorry that you never took interest in cabs that I've made for steamers. If you contacted me, I would most probably have done some, for your Locos. I've 99% completed a Cab for Fozzy,s new K36, and without blowing my trumpet or nose or whatever, it really does not look too bad.
Johan. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
century242 (133 posts)
May-02-02, 10:31 PM (EDT) 5. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" As for sounds, how about taking sounds from the late GREAT Howrd Fogg's record "The Talking Giants", just so happen I have 2 of them sitting right in front of me. One was my dad's(whom got it directly from the maker), and the other I just got today(brand new unopened). 1st off we have a C&S 2-8-0 whistling,
2- C&S 2-8-2 climbing hill,3- C&S 2-10-2 meets a 2-8-2, 4- Nickel P 2-8-4 fast freight, 5- SP 4-8-8-2 stops, 6- RG(ng) 2 2-8-2s climbing hill, 7- RG(ng)downhill 2-8-2, plus side two
3 C&S 2-8-0s and a 2-10-2, UP 4-6-6-4, B&O 2-8-8-4, and UP's 8444 twice."KEEP ON TRUCKIN BY TRAIN"
"Your Freight Goes Great, When it Goes By Great Northern"

Erik Pierson
Sacramento, Ca
http://espeesd9.tripod.com/sacramentolocomotiveworks Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
timken (401 posts)
May-02-02, 11:27 PM (EDT) 7. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" You have to change either the wav files (each of the many power cruise files)to the speed of chuffs you need, or make modifications to the sms file. I've found, that to get realistic sounds, takes changes to both. The way KUJU set the sms files up, chuff rate sounds change several times, using first one, then fading it out while fading in the next, to cover up the fact that it isn't continuously changing. So there are two streams of sounds. By using far more wav files in one stream, much more accurate rates can be achieved. These are linked to distance traveled, so if the wheels slip, the sound does not change. The alternative, which I'm using, uses a variable1 setting instead of speed. This is linked to the speed of wheel rotation, so if the drivers slip, the sound speeds up. With a lot of fiddling with recordings, I make many more sound files, so the sound syncs very well, not perfectly though, with the driver's revolutions.Look through the Sound Forum for quite a few threads on this topic. If you search for me, Timken, I've probably had something to say in most of them, so you should find them pretty easily.None of this is terribly difficult, but it is tedious and very time consuming!Steve Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Hoppy504 (80 posts)
May-03-02, 05:22 AM (EDT) 8. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma"
The ESE set appears to be available at this site complete with the upgrade. Have not tried to download as I got it from TA direct.http://www.trainsim.ru/en/download.shtml?action=sect§ion=locomotives&ln=enBest of luck,
John Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
chucksc (1531 posts)
May-03-02, 07:14 AM (EDT) 9. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" I wonder if those Russians are aware or care that they are violating TA's copywrite and rules of use by hosting those files... I'm pretty sure they don't have permission to do so...FYI as an IT professional I do not ever download anything from a Russian or main-land China or Israeli site.... The reason being that the HACKERs and virus makers all (Or more accurately a disproportionate percentage) seem to live and work over in those places and IMPO you are taking your life into your hands going there (Virtually).... Not being a Racist! Just being realistic based on observed behavior!------Chuck Schneider---------

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Hoppy504 (80 posts)
May-03-02, 09:20 AM (EDT) 10. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Hi Chuck,I noticed the ESE when I was downloading a couple of Russian locos which were made in house, they have a number of foriegn locos. Whether they have approval I do not know, just thought I would pass information on.
By the way their own locos are good.John. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Andriej (21 posts)
May-03-02, 11:03 AM (EDT) 11. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Hi chuck I'm living in Poland have you ever been to Eastern or Central europe? - it is probably easy to say that somebody is thief, hacker, cracker etc (especially when it lives in russia or another poor country - it is some kinde of propaganda?? I wonder if such a groups like razor 1911 are also russian groups of crackers?). You should try russian locos and wagons availabel on their site they are really good.
Stary nie wytrzymam jesteœ kurwa ¿a³osny jeœli wszyscy amerykanie s¹ tacy popierdoleni to moje kondolencje to sie chyba bierze z braku przyziemnych problemów (nie chce mi siê wiêcej pisaæ,rêce opadaj¹ jak siê takie pierdo³y czyta).
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chucksc (1531 posts)
May-03-02, 06:26 PM (EDT) 13. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" As a retired US Naval Officer who did a lot of his service in the North Atlantic/Arctic you might say I have "Organizational Experience" dealing with them.... I agree that they are pretty desperate over there in the former Soviet Union... However they also now have the world's premier mafia (organized crime syndicate)!!!! However, that does not excuse the huge volume of professional hackers and identity thieves present and awash.... I am just advising you to stay away from their sites as a significant number of sites in that area are "trojans" and just because you have sympathy for them does not relieve you from the responibility to protect yourself!This is not propaganda it is fact... I am an IT professional of some 35 years experience (More or less Military and Civilian) with a fairly heavy background in information security....If their stuff gets uploaded here and passes Nels' security checks then its probably OK...
Visiting it in "The Wild" is probably not a good idea!
I stand by my statements...
------Chuck Schneider---------

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chucksc (1531 posts)
May-03-02, 06:27 PM (EDT) 14. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" BTW, What's a nice Polish lad like you doing standing up for the Soviets??????
Isn't that kinda like a black jewish lawyer defending the Skinheads?
------Chuck Schneider---------

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Andriej (21 posts)
May-04-02, 02:52 AM (EDT) 16. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" No comment chuck...
I really don't know what to say... you probably think that you are the most clever,wise... person on earth - so you must be proud of you, but I think you are simply racist nad nationalist. You think that you are the greatest historian but you should remember that we don't have occupation since 1989 (13 years). Why do you think that we should hate all ordinary people from Russia I don't see the point? You also probably think that we should also hate Germans, Austrians, Hungarians, Swedes and maybe also negros and chinese (from some historical reasons)??
I hope that not all Americans are like you I give up you win.
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chucksc (1531 posts)
May-04-02, 12:20 PM (EDT) 22. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Nope I know I'm not any where near the most clever or wise!Now tell me if I'm going too fast for you here!You guys have no real defense and you know what I said is basically correct so you went personal...
Here in the States we call that the "O-J defense" after the alledged wife beater and murderer who apparently got off by racially polarizing the jury in his criminal trial!
I am not racist! And I resent the inference that you make! Rememeber Progrom is not an English/American word! I'm not even anti-russian! Nor Anti-German (Hell I'm 1/2 German-American! The other 1/2 Irish-American! Though I admidt that Some Frenchmen give me a royal pain in the a$$ ) For the benefit of the many unsophisticated users on here I was just repeating data from various advisories Publically given by the FBI's National Infrastructure Protection Center and several private security companies here in the West!
They almost all start out or contain something like "Due to rampant criminal activity and the effective lack of control/regulation by the local government(s) it is advised that users not Visit, download or install software from Russian, Mainland Chinese and Israeli/Palistinian Web sites!"(These last two guys primarily because they are in a war and attack each other over the internet and an innocent user can get caught)... I deal with IT security for a living on a daily basis.The facts are; There are enough "Bent" Russian sites and Programmers out there in the "wild" that the FBI, British Intelligence and the Surete to name a few have all issued similar warnings to Internet users in their respective countries!So I repeat my original question, "Why are you defending Russian Criminal Hackers and the Russian Mafia?"And no I did not say Peter K's site is "Bent" or that he is a member of the "Caviar Mafia"... Just until the Russian Government gains control of the criminal element on the Russian side of the Internet... I'm sure his stuff is great! Especially the coming Trans-Siberian Route! And if he uploads to Train-Sim and Nels gets a chance to "de-louse" it if necessary (BTW, The same proceedure My releases go through on here) then I will try them out! Until then I'm not interested!If that makes me a racist in your eyes then so be it!IMHO If you and the other people on here who take personal offense at what I said spent 1/2 the effort trying to clean up this mess that you did being offended at something that is not even about you then we would not be having this conversation! Krist! Fozzy I guess its my turn in the barrel! LOL!------Chuck Schneider---------

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peteK (52 posts)
May-03-02, 03:17 PM (EDT) 12. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" LAST EDITED ON May-03-02 AT 03:18 PM (EDT)Sorry, chucksc. But please show me the Trainartisan rules what we breaked?Sincerely, Kirillov Peter
http://www.trainsim.ru/en/ Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
chucksc (1531 posts)
May-03-02, 06:30 PM (EDT) 15. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Hang on Peter I'm going to see if I can find them in their documentation and also get Cyrus to define their(TAs) re-distribution rules for you.....------Chuck Schneider---------

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gokeefe (25 posts)
May-04-02, 04:04 AM (EDT) 17. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" LAST EDITED ON May-04-02 AT 04:18 AM (EDT)I'm not exactly sure how to do this so here goes...The following is copied and pasted from the Software License Agreement from the ESE 2.0"You may freely distribute this software in its full
unaltered archived format provided that you do not
receive any financial gain from said distribution or
use. If distribution is part of a larger commercial
effort, written permission must be provided by
Cyrus Lum (acylum@trainartisan.com) before distribution
can take place."Until I read the SLA more carefully I would have immediatley agreed with Chuck that TA didn't allow distribution of its software...I think I got this impression because TA never posted ESE or any of its software to the File Library. That is a natural step when you want to maintain exclusive control over distribution. As a strict question of copyright rules etc. it seems that the Russian site (www.trainsim.ru) is distributing the TA software in a manner that is consistent with the SLA. However, I must admit that my first impression about this was entirely to the contrary and that the free distribution clause in the SLA was a big surprise.gokeefeGO NAVY...
BEAT ARMYps. Disclosure: I downloaded the ESE 2.0 off the Russian Site in order to get a look at the SLA. Obviously this could have been altered...however, there was nothing at all that indicated in any way that the software had been altered. Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
Andriej (21 posts)
May-04-02, 04:36 AM (EDT) 18. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" At last somebody (except Petek) read Ta SLA - Again thanks for compliments chuck I've never forgot that "I'm like black jewish lawyer defending the Skinheads" thanks a lot white and proud navy superman.
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Andriej (21 posts)
May-04-02, 05:29 AM (EDT) 19. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" (I mean not only Petek not except -sorry Petek) Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
gokeefe (25 posts)
May-04-02, 06:42 AM (EDT) 20. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" I don't like flame threads, and I'm not going to start now. I will say that I always will have a deep and abiding respect for those men and women who serve in the Armed Forces of the United States.

Therefore, given the context of Mr. Schneider's experience in the military and afterwards I was not surprised at his comments on the dangers of using online resources in Russia, Israel, China and other countries. I think there was and still is a basis for saying that using these sites is dangerous but now it may be less so than it was in the past. As far as the ethnic humor that was tossed back and forth I would say that at some point somebody chose between laughing and frowning.
If one thinks carefully about what other people post and every once in a while gives a person the benefit of the doubt that they deserve it is much easier to understand that person than it is if you allow yourself to be offended by them.
My rule of thumb is that people rarely intend to offend, especially when they are using humor. Furthermore, we can find better ways to respond to that which we find offensive rather than condemning them. In short, if you find something that someone says to be off-color humor that you can't deal with then say exactly that, no less and, hopefully, no more.gokeefe Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
peteK (52 posts)
May-04-02, 07:13 AM (EDT) 21. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" we are at some kind of war or we are all RAILROAD FANS?what's a difference - russian, american, ñhinese, pole?As for me. My idea: show railfans all around the world RUSSIAN trains. I'm not going to send troyans and other viruses. Check our site and files by virus scans if somebody suspect something bad...SIGH Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
chucksc (1531 posts)
May-04-02, 12:28 PM (EDT) 23. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" OK Pete your stuff is great! Seriously! So when do you upload it to Train-Sim? I still will not use a Russian Web-Site..
However I stand by my warnings to the uninformed about Russian Websites in general and ad nauseum! I was making a joke Andrej about the Black Jewish Civil Rights Lawyer defending the Skin heads... It actually happens!
As far as you not using Trojans or Hacks... You "probably" don't! However IF you were BENT then I would expect you to say you don't! So the question is who do I listen to You or the FBI, British Intelligence and the Surete??????What a quandry!------Chuck Schneider---------

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peteK (52 posts)
May-04-02, 02:33 PM (EDT) 26. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" > So when do you upload it to Train-Sim?
like TrainArtian I don't want to publish my addons somewhere else.... But we'll discuss (with over developers) about train-sim.com Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top
chucksc (1531 posts)
May-04-02, 02:43 PM (EDT) 27. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" That is one of the main attractions that Train-Sim.com has for us other than we don't have to manage a website with high volume traffic....
We know that if Nels vets it, it is clean from virus infection and at least unzips and the installer runs! Just a final step in the Quality Process....------Chuck Schneider---------

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chucksc (1531 posts)
May-04-02, 12:33 PM (EDT) 24. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" LAST EDITED ON May-04-02 AT 12:38 PM (EDT)You are welcome!
FYI, That is sarcasm!BTW, I am not a "Navy Superman"!In English that statement about Black Jewish Lawyer defending skin heads is called a dramatic license or exageration for effect!again you prove my point! There is enough Internet Criminal Activity in the former Soviet Union that you know it and are embarassed about it and rather than acknowledge it or keep silent you chose to make a Personal Attack on Me and call me a racist for stating well known public facts!I think that is called the "OJ Defense"????------Chuck Schneider---------

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chucksc (1531 posts)
May-04-02, 12:36 PM (EDT) 25. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" I just got an E-Mail from Cyrus and he is writting to Nels concerning this matter... FYI, I too was shocked to find the "Free use" statement in there as TA has recently denied NALW and several other Freeware Developers redistribution rights for parts of the ESE and other TA packages (Specifically in our case the Cab and Sounds) citing their commercial agreements!------Chuck Schneider---------

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CMO (113 posts)
May-05-02, 00:49 AM (EDT) 28. "RE: Steam Sound and Cab dilemma" Perhaps TA let the cat out of the bag, and can't now recapture it! Remove | Alert Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

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