Fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes after

LAST EDITED ON Jun-23-03 AT 11:22 PM (EDT)

. I'm rebuilding this PC with XP Pro and am having crash problems when I test MSTS. It was a clean install (reformat drive), XP is up to date, video drivers are up to date, MSTS is up to date and I *believe* I've covered all other software/driver issues.
. The symptoms are consistant. I'll start the prog and start an explore route on any of several routes and usually about 3 -4 minutes into it ... blue screen crash ... "can't continue , get administrative assistance" .... have to power off to reset. At least I had found how to pause here so I could read it. There's on option to auto reset that I found and turned off. There is no phone home type crash, this one takes XP all the way down. The blue screen is cut off across the top of the screen so I can't read everything its trying to tell me, but unless there are many lines there, there is not much info' being shown.
. Other symptoms, if I start MSTS and don't start an activity, stays up fine. The first few times the crashes seemed to happen at nearly the same instant, approx. 4 minutes after the start of the activity. Then I had a few that happened sooner. Heat is not a problem. I've started an activity and just let the loco idle ... always crashes. I've tested several other prog's that tax this PC with no failures ( a MAJOR improvement over winME !!) This computer has been running well for a few days before I got around to installing MSTS.
. I'm only working with the default stuff (updated), and have not added ANY additional Routes, rolling stock, etc.
. I thought I had read a similar post on this, but I haven't found it. If anyone has thoughts, ideas, help, etc. will be greatly appeciated. Thanks for any and all helpLyle

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, derekmorton, Jun-24-03, 00:18 AM, (1) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, slyone, Jun-24-03, 00:54 AM, (2) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, bwfer, Jun-24-03, 12:22 PM, (3) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, slyone, Jun-24-03, 02:06 PM, (4) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, sniper297, Jun-24-03, 03:10 PM, (5) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, slyone, Jun-24-03, 05:35 PM, (9) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, elementb, Jun-24-03, 03:23 PM, (6) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, Bing, Jun-24-03, 03:41 PM, (7) RE: fresh XP install, activities crash 2 to 4 minutes a, baldwin, Jun-24-03, 04:29 PM, (8)

Conferences | Topics | Previous Topic | Next Topic

Is it possible you have a hardware problem?

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

LAST EDITED ON Jun-24-03 AT 00:57 AM (EDT)

not *too* likely, as I've not added any new hardware. Of course there have been massive software changes which could still lead to driver issues. From a hardware standpoint, everything (seemed to have) worked while in this box running winME. I did replace ME for a reason, maybe hardware is still in the mix. My hope is someone recognizes the symtoms and has fixed the problem.Lyle

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

On the limited information provided... I would venture a guess that something on your graphics is failing when it reaches a certain temperature... probably the graphics memory.MSTS is one of the the most resource intensive applications/programs I have ever seen!! It is probably causing your graphics card (and system)to increase in temperature substantially in addition to using graphics memory and resources that most of your other applications will never require.In my system MSTS increases my CPU Core temperature 30-40 deg F. and GPU Core Temperture 10-20 deg F!!The fact that the activity starts and runs about 4 minutes sure appears to me to be some of a thermal problem.Another possibility could be a software conflict caused by another application starting while you are running MSTS.The fact that you are getting this type of crash in WIN XP Pro to me indicates some type of hardware problem.Just a few disjointed thoughts

Brian

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

. all thoughts are welcome. I'm not discounting the thermal possibilities, but this is the same hardware I've been using for some time. BUT ... I will admit that yesterday was the first really warm day in this area (almost 90°) and the AC is not on yet. Inside was still 70 something. The box has been running open air with the side panel removed. If there's something in the nature of XP and it's processes that might cause extra heating because it's working harder/faster then you have a case. I'm not very knowledgable yet about the subtleties of XP.
. I've only had XP in place for four days, didn't install MSTS until yesterday. I've tested a few other prog's I know load the proc' and they ran without incident ... tried a couple in parallel for good measure. I agree that MSTS really loads it tho'. I have a lot of variables at this point, and am trying to pin it down. I got an e-mail from someone else who had similar symptoms, so at least I'm not alone in this.Lyle

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Cheapest way I can think of to troubleshoot, replace the system RAM. If you can borrow a similar video card do that next, but one thing I've found is that modern RAM (starting probably 10 years ago) can and will past the BIOS POST test with flying colors, only to fail when the faulty memory address block is accessed. Programs that don't fill your RAM all the way up have no problems, programs like MSTS that use a lot of RAM will tickle chips and capacitors that normally sit idle, and find the bad ones.

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

I wish I could be confident in saying it can't be hardware, but I do have to restate that none of the hardware is different from the winME installation on which MSTS worked. I was having crash problems that I attributed to the OS, but there is a possibility that hardware was an issue before and remains now. The present crash however is ONLY in MSTS, where in the ME setup other prog's, including 'notepad' - a very *challenging* programs - could crash it. On ME, MSTS could run complete activities in busy yards with frame rates in the single digit ballpark without crashing. This makes me believe I was using most if not all of the available RAM and processor cycles then. In the present I'll start an 'explore route', leave the loco at idle with brakes applied, and stay in the cab (not changing views) and the crash will happen every time. Something I'm going to try as a result of reading some of the messages here -- put MSTS into a window and watch a 'free memory' monitor I sometimes invoke, see if I pick up anything.Lyle

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

I have had the same type of problem with my compuer in the past. The first time that it happened it was because the computer was overheating, MSTS is very graphics intensive and it seems to be even more so in XP. If usually your motherboard will come with software that can track the temperature, you might want to use this and if this is the problem you will need to find a way to cool your system, such as adding more fans.The second time this happened it turned out that I had added a defective memory sim and it was causing the same type of problem.

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

I run MSTs on a WinXP HOme machine, T-4400 vid card, 512 Meg RAM, AMD Athlon XP2000+. Six fans in the case, the components still get warm, I take the side panel off the case and run a fan in the direction - not pointed IN the case, which ain't supposed to be good.Warm, here, too, our two or three days of 85+ degrees, most of us don't have AC. We tell people, "I turned on the AC today - opened the back door." But I can sure get the rig to crash BSOD if I OC the processor with certain routes, ditto with the vid card, though not as easily. Also has something to do with View 4, jumping around, can't do that if I want to stay in the game. WinXP is a pig, what else can I say? It is a pile of crap. No improvement at all in any area except minor error handling. A faster CD-RW than the Win98SE machine I run side by side with the WInXP rig, itself SLOWER than everything in in XP rig, takes LESS time to write the same block of data. Appreciably longer. Not ony that, I am never certian WHEN XP has finished. The activity light goes out, but that does not mean a thing. There has to be a reason IOmega issued a patch for their Zip drvies to "speed up WinXP writes" - they wouldjn't have done that just for the fun of it.Check vid crivers - they can do some weird things. Check all parameters in D3D - if you don't have DXDiag up and running, I would do so right away. You runnng DX8 or 9? The driver issue is VERY important with DX9. I would get and use RivaTuner - check everything then "Reload" the driver. MIght be a temp problem - I use Sandra 2003 to monitor the CPU temps, we've been doing OK considering how hot it is; my crashes are OC all the way, not from temps issues. Did i mention that when I installed DX9 to use with existing MSTS that DX9 trashed MSTS? Had to uninstall TS, reinstall it.Hey, guys, isn't this fun? Yeah, like hitting your thumb with a hammer, it feels so good when you stop.Bing

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Sorry I cant help with the actual problem, but just wanted to say that I have made the transition from 98SE to XP Pro, upgraded to DX9, upgraded my video and motherboard drivers and every time had no problems. All is running properly, no crashes, except when fiddling around with the coupling statement, no freezes or BSOD. My machine is Athlon 2100XP, A7v333 mobo, 512mb ddr ram, GF4 4400Ti. I have 3 HDD and a CD-RW and a handful of USB connections. This lot is where I have a very small problem, which may also be contributing to other peoples difficulties. The power supply (PSU) is not quite large enough to power everything properly. I currently have a 300w unit and have just purchased a 550w unit to replace it.mervyn@madasafish.com

Alert | IP

[ Home | MSTS Forum | MSTS FAQ | File Library ] Copyright © 2002 by Nels Anderson. All Rights Reserved.