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I don't get it… why is this forum going like this?

Started by ace6879 28 posts 18 min read

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ace6879Charter Member · 1179 posts

Hi all, Recent events of this morning have led me to believe that something is amiss here. the post Marc made of leaving because of a name has obviously been removed. I logged on earlier ths morning and posted a reply to this, as I see MANY did. I didn't get a chance to read the others...however, I noticed the names of the senders and wonder what the hell could have been so bad to remove it. this brings up a topic....Why are some posts removed, and others left for people to bash and bicker? I have seen some terrible flame wars lately, and not a damn thing is done to stop it IE: Remove it.The same ones cause the trouble CONSTANTLY. Why are they not suspended or banned? Because of free speach? Bull....This crap has GOT to stop!If your gonna remove ONE post, why don't you remove ALL the flame posts as they happen! Don't give me the bull "I didn't see it"We are losing the QUALITY members to the trolls because they are ALLOWED to continue their bantering and bashing! Nels, Macster...I usually keep quiet and do my best to help and be friendly...but come on guys, ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!!! We have rules! I remember when yuo got into it Macster,you said things were gonna change! They seem to be, but for the worst!I have no problemwith yuo guys, and I APPRECIATE ALL of the work you do...But you need to STOP the trolls!!! Don't say you don't know who they are either!I apologize for taking such a stance, but I ENJOY this forum! I have been here for close to a year now,and I have seen a general trend of some to deliberately use this as a place of fighting and bickering. I don't want to see anyone else leave, ESPECIALLY not ME!!!SO for all who are reading this, please don't take this as an attack, but rather a plea for change!! Thanks!!!Kelley D. Ellison
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CSX A-Line Chief lighting engineer
NALW Lighting engineer
Dekosoft Lighting engineer

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RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, UPnut, Aug-13-02, 12:12 PM, (1) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, CSX_Jim, Aug-13-02, 12:35 PM, (2) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, downside, Aug-13-02, 12:40 PM, (3) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, Macster, Aug-13-02, 12:51 PM, (4) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, CSX_Jim, Aug-13-02, 01:02 PM, (5) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, ace6879, Aug-13-02, 01:04 PM, (6) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, LawrenceKellie, Aug-13-02, 01:05 PM, (7) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, georgi55, Aug-13-02, 01:12 PM, (8) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, SHEPLEY1935, Aug-13-02, 01:54 PM, (14) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, georgi55, Aug-13-02, 01:59 PM, (15) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, SHEPLEY1935, Aug-13-02, 02:43 PM, (23) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, georgi55, Aug-13-02, 02:46 PM, (24) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, wrmayes, Aug-13-02, 02:22 PM, (19) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, CSX_Jim, Aug-13-02, 02:31 PM, (21) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, georgi55, Aug-13-02, 02:35 PM, (22) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, SVTS, Aug-13-02, 01:19 PM, (9) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, rdamon, Aug-13-02, 01:24 PM, (10) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, georgi55, Aug-13-02, 01:34 PM, (12) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, CSX_Jim, Aug-13-02, 01:37 PM, (13) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, DKlemm, Aug-13-02, 01:25 PM, (11) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, edwardk, Aug-13-02, 02:17 PM, (16) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, Macster, Aug-13-02, 02:19 PM, (17) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, ace6879, Aug-13-02, 02:20 PM, (18) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, Macster, Aug-13-02, 02:30 PM, (20) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, SHEPLEY1935, Aug-13-02, 02:50 PM, (25) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, Andre, Aug-13-02, 03:03 PM, (26) RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this, 7andY, Aug-14-02, 04:14 AM, (27)

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UPnutMember since Jun-27-02 · 86 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-02 AT 12:13 PM (EDT)

I'm not sure what went on this morning either. but the part about the trolls was well writen ace.John

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CSX_JimMember since Jun-27-02 · 51 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-02 AT 12:39 PM (EDT)

In all fairness to Nels and Macster, it would be almost next to impossible to ban anyone from the forums or the site as far as that goes. You can already see that there are folks with multiple logins so there isn't a very close watch made on the account system. Banning someone would only result in their coming back and just continuing until their account was deleted. The cycle would just continue on.The wisest comment I've seen has just been to ignore these folks. Sooner but probably later they will move on. Some will hang around forever. Most of us realize and appreciate the contributions that are made by the productive few. As in everything, there are the nay-sayers and critics and as in other circumstances we ignore them as well so just continue to do so here. The sooner we realize the futility of trying to reason with these folks the sooner the forums will be filled with less wasted "words of wisdom" and filled with productive, helpful conversations.I do believe that if a comment or topic is not directly related to the MSTS area of interest for that particular group that it should be deleted or thrown to the General Discussion forum. That way those of us who prefer not to read their "words of wisdom" can spend our time reading the helpful hints that we come here to find.

Jim

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downsideCharter Member · 646 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-02 AT 12:42 PM (EDT)

The problem is that you can join this forum with a multitude of names and virtually anonymous email addresses. Many other forums I belong to will not accept you until the application has been approved. Others will not allow email addresses such as hotmail and yahoo.This site is more liberal, maybe partly because a lot of the members are youngsters who for one reason or another can only use such email providers. The last thing we need to do is discourage them from participating in something the majority of us love - MSTS and all it entails. For that we have to put up with the trolls whose main aim is to cause disruption and friction.For my part I would like to see threads started by such people wiped out as soon as they start. There are those among us (including me at times) who like to reply so as to try and wind the troll up. Even I realise that this really is a pointless exercise as with the exception of one or two, once they have started the thread they do not contribute to it again but get their perverted pleasure in reading the replies.I have resolved never to reply to a troll again. If everyone else does the same they will soon go away. With the speed with which threads are generated it will not be too long before their thread has disappeared into far-flung pages. Keep replying and it keeps appearing as number one on page one.Thats it. Enough said.Happy simming allBillEdit - I started writing this some while ago but the 'phone rang which is the reason some of the other comments have been duplicated.

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MacsterCharter Member · 712 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

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I don't get it… why is this forum going like this? – image 35

?! I just got back from Vacation...so I didn't see any of that...So... *steps to the side and continues editing his Sandpoint pics*

Brian E. Bundridge
Founder - Evergreen Tracks
Seattle, Washington

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CSX_JimMember since Jun-27-02 · 51 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

So Brian, based on our comment, are we to understand that your concern about moderating the forums is secondary to your latest project?I would think if you saw a topic such as this and read the messages that you just might want to read through some of the recent messages and see what has been going on while you were on vacation.In more than one message you have been taken to task about claiming things were going to change around here and that the only change appears to be negative and not positive. Your comment seems to imply a nonchalant attitude toward the forums and what is going on in them. I think we all would appreciate a clarification of what your comment was intended to mean.

Jim

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ace6879Charter Member · 1179 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

Well, For the mostpart I agree it is tough...but I log on several times a day usually..and Yes, I still have a life... I don't know what needs to be done..but it has GOT to change somehow!!When this gets to the point it ain't fun anymore because every time a post comes up your affraid to answer or getting flamed because you have a different viewpoint, things need to change. It is even worse when you are affraid to release a car or something else you worked on because your affraid to get flamed. Constructive critisisim is one thing, but outright flaming is crap! I was TERRIFIED to release ANY of the repaints I did
due to this reason!!! (Although I was VERY happy and proud of the responses I did get..and I thank all wwho downloaded them!!)I understand there are people who you can't please..Believe me, I work as a DJ/KJ and you can NEVER please the public!!! I just hope there is a way to stop this and the forum go back to the way it still can be at times..very fun and informative! And again, this ain't a "boo hoo" letter...I just love this place and want it to stay a quality place to have fellowship and information!!Later!!
Kelley D. Ellison
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CSX A-Line Chief lighting engineer
NALW Lighting engineer
Dekosoft Lighting engineer

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LawrenceKellieCharter Member · 1566 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

Further to Jim's comment, Macster, who was supposed to be moderating while you were gone?Lawrence

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georgi55Charter Member · 1091 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

Take a look at bcdef.
Bunch of old farts bashing a 14 year old teenager all the time.
Adults that thier body grew up but brain is still baby. This is what most of this forum is made of. Georgi

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SHEPLEY1935Charter Member · 668 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

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LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-02 AT 01:57 PM (EDT)

Well Young Sir...based on your comment you condone prevarication, which is your right, but it is not a personal trait that most of we "Old Timers" find interesting or acceptable. When you have been out on the avenue busting your little tushy trying to hang onto a job, raise a family and pay the bills you will find out what growing up is all about. I advise you to be more circumspect about the important things in life and MSTS is not one of them!

Don Shepley-Chicago

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georgi55Charter Member · 1091 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-02 AT 02:03 PM (EDT)

Why are you taking this comments personaly?Edit:
I respect my parents, teachers and prophesors I've had, but being this forum and looking the way some adults act, there is no way I can respect many of them.

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SHEPLEY1935Charter Member · 668 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

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Because your derogatory comment about "Old Timers" is an asualt on a lot of Forum Members who do not deserve to be castigated because of their age!

Don Shepley-Chicago

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georgi55Charter Member · 1091 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

If you know its not you what you got to worry about?
I have 3 friends from this forum who are over 50 years old and we exchnage emails from time to time about MSTS
and especialy issues abotu ATi since that's how we started exchanging emails.Georgi

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wrmayesCharter Member · 50 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

Hi Georgi;Does this mean that it is ok for teenagers to bash other teenagers or for teenagers to bash adults?It would seem that this forum also has some teenagers who have no brain at all!Randy

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CSX_JimMember since Jun-27-02 · 51 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

LAST EDITED ON Aug-13-02 AT 02:31 PM (EDT)

Don,You need to take it easy on these young guys, many times their vocabulary hasn't progressed to a level of understanding 'condone' I do have to agree with you about his comment. The kid does take a lot of bashing but it isn't just from adults nor does the bashing give a representation of the entire group of folks in these forums.

Jim

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SVTSCharter Member · 325 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

I should know, mine was one of the post removed. All my post said was to ignore what the person had to say, and his post would find it's way back to the archives.I'm not sure why it was removed. I looked up to the 3rd page, and it wasn't there, so I assume Nels took it upon himself to remove any and all that had to do with the person.Chris

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georgi55Charter Member · 1091 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

LOL! Good one Robert. I can qualify many people from here into each category on that site. Georgi

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DKlemmCharter Member · 1720 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

Kelley;I'll email you off line on what was deleted and I don't know if I was the first to notify Nels, but I emailed him becasue a guy started a poll and his sign on name, was well, terrible. In fact one of the words if typed in a message would have been replaced with asteriks. Again, after I email you with what it said, I'm confident you will agree it had to be deleted. I hope the persons account was as well.

David Klemm
Illinos & St Louis Divisions
IC Version .8 uploaded

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edwardkCharter Member · 78 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

I find that the most difficult thing for people to do is to overlook posts that cause a flame fest. If a person is creating a post that is negative, ignore it, do not respond to it. This also applies to people who develop routes & models. If a person creates a post that could be interpreted as negative to the developer, ignore it. I don't know if what I mentioned above is possible, but I believe it is worth a try.Edward K.

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MacsterCharter Member · 712 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

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I don't get it… why is this forum going like this? – image 70

Geez... you guys don't think I got a life other then Train Sim... well.. sadly your wrong... when I am out and about which is pretty common (hey, it's 80+ in Seattle..i'm taking advantage of that!) Nels typically looks over the forum, though, I forgot to let him know about my leavings do to leaving in a hurry to get to Spokane. Whatever happened WHILE I WAS AWAY, I don't know.. I just happened to pop in and happen to read this.. made a reply and boom.. this comes up. My presence on Train Sim will be reduced now that the Seattle test route is under construction, after that is completed, my presence will decrease even more so when Evergreen Tracks begans on the Milwaukee Road Coast Route.So, for those whom think I (live) on this forum, I don't, and don't expect the mods to always quickly and swiftly delete a message or a thread....nuff said. any other comments needs to be directed towards Nels.. as I stated eariler.. i was enjoying my vacation with my friends in Sandpoint.. of course.. there is another reason to why I was out there, but I'll leave the guessing up to you guys.

Brian E. Bundridge
Founder - Evergreen Tracks
Seattle, Washington

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ace6879Charter Member · 1179 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

Hi all, First of all Georgi, I ain't an old fart!!! 35 ain't old!!! (Even though I seem like it getting out of bed some days;-) )Second, after reading David Klemm's e-mail..It makes the above comments even more real!! Fozzy, just for the record if you read this, I consider you a great help and a great modeler as well! PLease don't get into a fight over this post guys!! That's waht ai am hopping to stop!!
Thanks!!Kelley D. Ellison
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CSX A-Line Chief lighting engineer
NALW Lighting engineer
Dekosoft Lighting engineer

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MacsterCharter Member · 712 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

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I don't get it… why is this forum going like this? – image 105

Hehe.. i hope i didn't sound to "pissy?" in that post, but sheesh.. we can only do so much, and as I have stated over and over and over.. I only have limited controls to the forum, and it will stay like that. There is only so much we can do about the "trolls" and only can monitor the forum for so many hours.

Brian E. Bundridge
Founder - Evergreen Tracks
Seattle, Washington

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SHEPLEY1935Charter Member · 668 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

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Macster,
You do not owe any Forum Member a reason for your not always being available as a Forum Moderator! Hope you had a delightful holiday and look forward to running on the new routes!

Don Shepley-Chicago

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AndreCharter Member · 318 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

I am also one of the guys who informed Nels about the poll because it went way too far. There are things you don't do or say in public...but that guy did and crossed the line..Being on this forum for nearly a year i have seen a lot of fighting in fact too much fighting. Leave these kids and stupid adults alone, ignore them, don't reply and when they cross the line don't say anything to them. Don't give them their 15 minutes of fame.
Inform Brian and Nels instead and let them take action.And some people should just stop replying to everything said in the forum, they make it only worse.
André
I don't get it… why is this forum going like this? – image 106
www.mstrainstop.com
andre@mstrainstop.com

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7andYCharter Member · 28 posts

RE: I don't get it....why is this forum going like this

Hi all,Down in the bottom left corner of every posting is a text button marked 'Alert'. How about we use it a bit more, rather than replying to these trolls? It won't bump the message back to the top, and it will notify our Moderators to the fact that a posting has caused offence.Just my 2 pence worthHappy simming 7andY

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