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Soller tramway

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Reading Topic #530

Member since Nov-2-03 · 160 posts

Soller tramway – image 1

sure i don't understand spanish, but of course i can understand images...!!
look at this fantastic screenshot of the soller tramway founded here:
http://www.trensim.com/foro/viewtopic.php?t=1597&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
/maxSoller tramway – image 2Soller tramway – image 3Soller tramway – image 4Soller tramway – image 5Soller tramway – image 6Soller tramway – image 7

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RE: soller tramway..., Swissie, Nov-04-04, 04:50 AM, (1) RE: soller tramway..., dkunath, Nov-04-04, 01:46 PM, (2) RE: soller tramway..., Swissie, Nov-04-04, 06:49 PM, (3) RE: soller tramway..., henry3, Nov-05-04, 01:41 PM, (4) RE: soller tramway...Translation, Captain Bazza, Nov-06-04, 05:14 AM, (5) RE: soller tramway...Translation, wacampbell, Nov-06-04, 07:13 AM, (6) RE: soller tramway...Translation, CMO, Nov-06-04, 02:33 PM, (7) RE: soller tramway...Translation, Captain Bazza, Nov-07-04, 10:47 PM, (8) RE: soller tramway...Translation, Swissie, Nov-08-04, 07:51 AM, (9)

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Member since Sep-27-02 · 1347 posts

RE: soller tramway...

Hola Maxno, I don't speak Spanish and only understand some of it, either, but many thanks for the link to this really exceptional modell.I figured out a few interesting details from the post there. Namely that Jordi actually had to break down the model of this Brill single truck motor (which still runs the streets of the town of Sollèr, on the North coast of the Island of Palma de Mallorca as of today) into three separate models, which leaves you with an .eng and two .wag files for one car: The .s associated with the .eng groups all the parts whch have Solid Norm textures, the two .s files associated with the .wag file group all parts with Trans Norm and Solid Bright/Trans Bright.Jordi states that this was the only way to trick MSTS into accepting such a detailed model (poly count!), and who cares that running this car actually means running a consist of an eng+wag+wag?Towards the end of the post he states that he plans to release a pack of this car with different road numbers, liveries, and markings in roughly four months. Looks like a Christmas gift I want to have Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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Charter Member · 124 posts

RE: soller tramway...

Hi Lukas,I know that you mentioned that a pack of the brill will be available in about 4 months, but is the car show now available and what about the route--the scenery is incredible, is it available?Thanks,Dwayne

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Member since Sep-27-02 · 1347 posts

RE: soller tramway...

LAST EDITED ON Nov-04-04 AT 06:50 PM (EST)

Hi Dwayne,from what I can figure out - I only speak some Italian and had eight years of French in school, enough to get about 75% of the Spanish text translated - the author of the model, Jordi, says that he plans to release car 169 along with others in a package. Not surprisingly at all, the route seems to be part of his project. Jordi mentions that he had a sabbatical period recently, during which he built the Brill Type 23 single truck motor (and some of the route). He mentions having tons of fotos to work from, which seems to be the base for some very nice, fotorealistic texturing work.Needless to say that tranlating the answers by other posters boils down to a couple versions of saying "drool, I want it!" As far as the route is concerned, he states in a later post (second page):The first five are from a route named "Rail Classic" he had been working on, planned from the start to be released after MSTS 2 was out. With its cancellation, he put it to a halt, and doubts he will continue work on it, stating the limits of MSTS 1 and the Route Editor.The final screenshot is from a smaller route named "Tram Classic" which he set in a basically flat terrain. Then again, Jordi makes reference to the various projects of upcoming new simulators and their compatibility with MSTS, in my eyes signalling that he will wait with a publication until hard evidence exists that the route will work under the next generation of rail simulators.Hope I got it all right Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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Charter Member · 595 posts

RE: soller tramway...Translation

LAST EDITED ON Nov-06-04 AT 05:25 AM (EST)

A literal translation of the first post:
Hello to everybody. Despues to fight with the TSM and the MSTS to me, to obtain that this last one accepted the model of tranvia, that podeis to see in the captures that come next. Finally I have been able to concern it to MSTS. For the peculiar ones, I will say that after sabbatic months, taken so that one went the climb and the frustration to me, I have decided on a radical solution that has allowed me, finally, to see circulate the object of so many and so many hours of effort and that to MSTS it did not give the desire him to accept. The solution has consisted of dividing vehiculo in three different vehiculos (locomotive and two cars) that form a composition. First (the locomotive) it groups all the pieces with textures Solid Norm and similars. Segunto groups all the Trans Norm. And the third all Solid Bright and Trans Bright. Of this form MSTS it has had to good to accept the model. In order to comprise the composition and that each vehiculo (or of tranvia) occupies the place that corresponds to him, and altogether give the three the sensation of one single one, I have had to manipulate the archives eng, wag and sd, in the dimensions, I hook and bounding box. With to say, for example, that to vehiculo locomotive him I have had to assign length of "single millimeter", so that the other two occupy the relative position that corresponds to them, is already this whole. Tranvia reproduced, is a car of the type Brill 23 of tranvias of Porto (STCP), very wanted by my, strictly personal reasons. And of which I have good fotografias, with which I have been able to make textures that allow to give a good sensation of realism to the model. This vehiculo, happens to make company to tranvia on watch nº 66 of the STCP that I showed months ago. I hope to make other two tranvias Brill 23 with registration numbers different and of line, and to publish four more ahead (quizas in pack). I hope that you like the captures.... If it is that you like tranvias. A greeting to all.2nd post in same thread translates:
Before nothing, thank you very much to all. To tranvia it needs todavia some adjustments and adjustments. With respect to the questions on the route. In fact one is two routes: The five first captures, are made in my route Rail Càssic 2.0. This route is to means to do and I stopped it months ago, to the delay of the MSTS2. appearance But with the news that there is, because we will already see....... Now so far, I do not believe that continue. To work on a mountainous layout with the REDC is highly frustrating. In addition, once you have proven the publisher of TRS 2004, and return to the REDC, the frustrations and previous climbs, are multiplied by ten.... is highly irritating (the REDC). And one is dedicated to this to pass it well, does not stop to suffer with any nimiedad that to this program it less gives him by not aceptarte at the thought moment. Or said of another way: To do bién a route (real or fictitious) already is of by sufficiently complicated himself, like so that, ademas, you have to do as the publisher of routes dedicates to complicarte the life. What if I am trying now with MSTS, it is a much but simple route. It is of exclusively tranviario character, and I am raising it on a land totalment level in the zone urban, and slight and smoothly mountainous in the suburban zone. I am simplifying it to the maximum not to load it of polygons and to avoid therefore the so frustrating pulls.... We will already see that it happens. In this route in construction, it is where the sixth capture is done. Its name is (alive the originality): Tram Clàssic 1,0 I do not promise anything with respect to this route, because as the REDC begins to do of hers, the control to take wind and hope to some of the new simulators, that say that they will be compatible with MSTS. Enfin, nothing else, and I repeat: THANKS To ALL FOR The CONGRATULATIONS And The SPIRITS. A hug, _________________ JordiHis third post translates:
Thanks to everybody for the commentaries. Indeed fccarreño: They have certain similar with those of Lisbon. Leaving part which tranvias of I carry are of wide standard and those of Lisbon they are of via narrow (concretely of 900 mm of gauge). The similarity must that almost all tranvias Portuguese, with some exceptions in some séries of Lisbon, Coimbra and Porto, they are of American design, or Portuguese design inspired by American. Asi for example, car 169 that I have reproduced, belongs to a model of the company J. G. Brill de Philadelphia. Concretely to the type Brill 23 (23 seated seats) that was cars of a standard model of this company/signature, of the type "Semi-Convertible". This last one means, that they went equipped with a system of windows designed by Brill, by which these podian to retract themselves during the summer within double ceilings, located between linternon and the lateral ones of the hall passengers (of ahi the cleared form whom the interior of the ceiling in those zones presented/displayed), and this way "they convertian" open cars semi in summer. On the other hand, the cars from Lisbon to that you talk about, pertaining to série 700 of CARRIS (Carris of ferro of Lisbon) in Castilian: Iron tracks of Lisbon, correspond to a design developed by the own CARRIS that derives from the American designs of Brill. Concretely of the first cars of series 500 of CARRIS, that were also cars of the type Brill Semi-Convertible but this narrow time of via. The most apparent difference, was that cars 700, replaced the ceiling with linternon of the first 500, by a ceiling very made convex, characteristic of many tranvias Portuguese and tipico of the American tranviarios designs, of the Thirties and forty. The cars ex- Lisbon that circulate in Soller, pertenecian to series 700 of CARRIS. Pardon by peñazo of explanation, but not quite often can be spoken of tranvias. It is a very minority subject. and one is animated.... A greeting to everybody, Jordi.Fourth post in response to a question, I think:
Javier, As he commented in post previous, this tranvia has taken much work to me so that MSTS accepted it and it did not hang itself. The problem is in the structure of jerarquias of the different pieces that compose it (vehiculo has thirteen thousands and some poligonos). I reproduce the text that in this respect I put in the beginning of this thread: The solution has consisted of dividing vehiculo in three different vehiculos (locomotive and two cars) that form a composition. First (the locomotive) it groups all the pieces with textures Solid Norm and similars. Segunto groups all the Trans Norm. And the third all Solid Bright and Trans Bright. Of this form MSTS it has had to good to accept the model. In order to comprise the composition and that each vehiculo (or of tranvia) occupies the place that corresponds to him, and altogether give the three the sensation of one single one, I have had to manipulate the archives eng, wag and sd, in the dimensions, I hook and bounding box. With to say, for example, that to vehiculo locomotive him I have had to assign length of "single millimeter", so that the other two occupy the relative position that corresponds to them, is already this whole. This solution I do not like (she is not clean) and I am going to try to structure it of another way; to see if with himself. This is what it is restraining to me. Greetings, Jordi _________________ Jordi....and another:Hello Leeward, I use program TSM. Quizas is but the problematic one to obtain a structure of jerarquias, that the MSTS must to good accept. But it is a tremendously friendly program in his handling. By the way, in another order of things: I have observed, that all the Portuguese virtual modelistas, single reproducis material modern movil. The traction to steam in landscaping aesthetic Portugal and all and the railway one of their time, were truely sensational. Personally, I keep a close memory from my trips to Portugal at that time, to film the Portuguese steam trains. Specially, memory with a particular affection all "the estreita" line of via (Tua - Bragança, Regua - Chaves, Libraçao - Arc of Baulhe, the network of I carry, the network of the Vouga, etc.). It is a true pain, that all that I magnify movil material (mallet series E160 and E200, the Mikado series E130 and E140, 130T series E80 and E110, the cars of passengers German with its small furnaces of the heating in the platforms, etc...) does not deserve the attention of somebody. The lines of via narrow Portuguese, along with all their equivalent Spaniards, form without doubt, the set of more interesting line and with more "claw" of all Europe (with permission of the RhB), and by the sight they do not interest almost to anybody. She is one suffers. You think about all that material. The Portuguese steam deserves it. A greeting, _________________ Published: 14/07/2004 13:15 Leeward, forgot to me: If some of you is decided by algun material of via it narrows; please, modeladlo to circulate on via really narrows. Hagais that solution not to adapt it to via wide. The result is disastrous. Greetings, _________________ JordiPosted in the name of science (And apologies to Jordi - but such magnificent work deserves to be known.

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Member since Jun-30-02 · 288 posts

RE: soller tramway...Translation

LAST EDITED ON Nov-06-04 AT 07:13 AM (EST)

Now who's going to translate the machine translation? I think Lukas said it better.
Wayne

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Charter Member · 509 posts

RE: soller tramway...Translation

I agree.
Sounds like you have an eng file, and somehow jury-rig two wag files to fit on top of the eng file, This avoids the problem that MSTS has with solidnorm, alphanorm+ and halfbright materials in one file.
And also allows a lot more polys.
Would certainly be curious to see how it is done.

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Charter Member · 595 posts

RE: soller tramway...Translation

Heh, heh, I thought I was foxing clever. Without knowing the number of polys in total, it's hard to judge the logic of splitting a relatively non-complex vehicle (compared to a Mallet, etc) into three separate models. Is the problem of mixing texture types peculiar to any particular 3d prog? All my conversions are done manually, so I have greater control over the process. I rarely use AlphNorm, or TransNorm textures, but apart from being unable to get the default glass.tga/ace texture to work on my latest loco, I don't seem to have experienced the sort texture problems such as those intimated in Jordi's posts.I tend to build the model so if I wish to change the (brightness) texture on a particular part of the heirarachy, I make that object separately linked in the heirarachy. I then edit the shape file itself.On reflection, a town/city tramway route, such as that shown in those splendid screenshots, would hit on FPS, due the high number on scenery object per tile. The sim does prefer complex objects broken down into lower poly groups, but on the other hand, often higher poly groups of scenery objects work better as a single heirarachy, than several smaller indvidual objects.

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Member since Sep-27-02 · 1347 posts

RE: soller tramway...Translation

Hi Capt'nmy gut feeling and experience from messing in the RE is that fps hits are not only depending on the complexity (poly count) of scenery objects, but also the size of associated .ace files. A good case study is Enocell's package of induistrial buildings for his NJ route. Fairly easy, low poly shapes, but high detail 512x512 skins. Use groups of these buildings and your fps hits rock bottom. Use resampled 256x256 textures on the same group of buildings and the fps hardly changes when you approach them...Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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