Chicago EL trains

Can anyone help out here?? I installed cykwork Chicago EL trains yesterday and I'm having problems with a couple of the routes. On the Brown Loop, or the Purple Express routes the sim will crash to desktop shortly after passing the Armitage station as you're next to where the North/South line tracks are going into the subway. On the Red North/South route it won't even start. I get error msgs. such as "trains\Consists\CTA_Linden_2400_x8.con", "Service Red-North path 'Red North' set up after load failed", "Failed to set up trains for sim Activity: Red North". The same happens if I try to go to either Red North or South. The other lines all seem OK!! I hope someone can assist on this??? I'm fairly new to doing add-ons with train sim so you might say I'm a novice here!! Thanks for any help out there!!! Dan Green

Dan Green

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RE: Chicago EL trains, Swissie, Feb-26-04, 06:14 AM, (1) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Feb-26-04, 11:55 AM, (2) RE: Chicago EL trains, Swissie, Feb-26-04, 01:46 PM, (3) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Feb-27-04, 01:41 AM, (4) RE: Chicago EL trains, Swissie, Feb-27-04, 04:05 PM, (5) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Feb-28-04, 01:16 AM, (6) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Feb-28-04, 10:37 AM, (7) RE: Chicago EL trains, Swissie, Feb-28-04, 12:21 PM, (8) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Mar-01-04, 01:47 AM, (9) RE: Chicago EL trains, Swissie, Mar-02-04, 04:35 AM, (10) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Mar-02-04, 05:10 PM, (11) RE: Chicago EL trains, Swissie, Mar-04-04, 03:26 PM, (12) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Mar-04-04, 08:51 PM, (13) RE: Chicago EL trains, mrmike, Mar-08-04, 07:22 PM, (15) RE: Chicago EL trains, hawker, Mar-08-04, 03:19 PM, (14) RE: Chicago EL trains, Stamper, Mar-17-04, 10:29 PM, (16) RE: Chicago EL trains, DFGreen180, Mar-18-04, 01:17 AM, (17) RE: Chicago EL trains, Stamper, Mar-18-04, 01:21 PM, (18) RE: Chicago EL trains, TedB, Mar-18-04, 02:52 PM, (19)

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LAST EDITED ON Feb-26-04 AT 06:15 AM (EST)

Hi Danwelcome to train sim and you do not need to fear asking when you are at your wits end. Definitely not if you have specific problems or questions... I am aware that some folks seem to like flaming newbies asking
a) obvious things where the answer can be figured out quickly by just having a look at the FAQ's or doing a search on the fora,
b) demanding stuff better be made for them now, or
c) ask unspecific questions such as "my MSTS doesn't work. What do I do?"Enough said Uhm, you are running an activity, not in explore mode, are you?Then the error messages you report on the Red line seem to indicate that MSTS cannot find a consist (seemingly build from 8 CTA Linden 2400 motors, guessing from its name) which is needed for the activity (probably the player consist, if you get the message from the beginning on). The following messages are the logical consequence of that missing consist: The service needing the consist cannot be set up ("set up after load failed"), thus the sim cannot start the activity.First of all, you need to make sure that all the rolling stock for the route is installed in the trains/trainset directory. But apart from "having the equipment" you will also need to install the proper consists (.con-files) in the trains/consists folder. In case some are missing I suggest you get the tool "RouteRiter" from the file library and use it to check all activities. It will tell you what equipment and consists you miss.With regard to the route crashing in other places: Do you get error messages, or is it just freezing with a send/don't send screen? Let me just quickly ask this to be on the safe side: I assume you have the cykworks add-on tracks properly installed in the global folder? The route needs quite a collection of specially designed subway track pieces coming in that pack (cyktrck2.zip in the file library). In its latest release the pack is 100% compatible with xtracks, so you need not to worry if you also have this add-on pack which is required by a great deal of routes.Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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LAST EDITED ON Feb-26-04 AT 12:52 PM (EST)

Hello Lukas! Thanks for the reply! I've been selecting either 'Red North or South' activity which won't load and yes I get the error mesage at the beginning. So I will look further at my set-up to see if I've got it done correctly or not and I'll get the 'RouteRiter' tool and use it when I can. For the other problems the sim just crashes with no error messages or warnings. The train just goes to that one point and the sim just quits. I do have the 'cyktrck2.zip' installed which I did only 2 days ago so it should be the latest version. It had a .exe self-installer so I would think it would be properly installed! I've looked at the tsection.dat read me to see if that helps but being honest that stuff was pretty much "Greek" to me!! Sit here and go "Whaaaa?"!! So I'll look at the consist thing and see what I have and go from there I guess!! AS for the 'RouteRiter' tool I've got the free membership so it's usually pretty hard for me to get on TrainSim cause it's so busy! Again thanks for the help so far!! I just looked in my 'Consists' folder and it shows 2,4,6,and 8 car consists for the CTA trains with a lower case letter 'a' at the right side of each line. I'm not sure if that has any meaning or not. From here I'll admit that I'm lost as to what to do so if you can help further that would be great!!! Regards...Dan Green

Dan Green

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Hi Dandefinitely try to get Route Riter. Best tipp I can give you to get into the file library is to try at off-peak hours, such as early on in the morning. Evenings and weekends are worst... As for the consists? Do you have ConBuilder - if not, add that tool to your "gotta-get-it" list. It is not only handy to making up your own consists, it also lets you test the consists called for by an activity. In its toolbar, select the icon which looks like an analog clock with the letter A in its bottom. Then select the route, and then the activity you want to test the consists for. That'll present you with a list as to which consists the activity needs, and clicking the test consists button starts the test. Notice: As any computer program, MSTS is very picky that file names match. If the activity calls for CTA_Linden_2400_x8.con and you only have a CTA_Linden_2400_x8a.con in your consist folder, then that's more than enough to give you trouble. Unfortunately, you cannot just copy the CTA_Linden_2400_x8.con and rename the copied file. The filename is also referenced inside the file, and of course this must be edited to match before MSTS accepts the replacement (btw. your crashing without warning at the beginning of the activity could very well be attributed to such an inconsistence between a filename and reference inside a file, a thing MSTS detects only upon loading, at the same time causing it to spin to the desktop...) Best you can do is to run the ConBuilder check, note all the names of the consists you miss on a slip of paper, then go into ConBuilder and make up these missing consists yourself. Pay attention to name them precisely as the ones missing.That's about all I can think of for the moment, good luck in hunting down the error (btw: MSTS makes us all dive into its misteries from time to time, so do not feel too frustrated)Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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Hi Lucas. I will try to get the 'RouteRiter' and the 'ConBuilder' tools in the next few days. As for the consist folder can you not go in there thru a file manager (I have Norton File Manager) and edit say a consist line much like you can edit a Aircraft.cfg file in Flight Sim?? What you mention about my MSTS crashing with no warning and a inconsistance between a file name and referemnce inside a file has me sort of lost!! Sorry but could you maybe explain a bit which might help me as to what to look for?? Again Thanks so much for trying to help!! Regards... Dan G. PS: I am presuming that those tools you mention have "how to" read mes with them??

Dan Green

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LAST EDITED ON Feb-27-04 AT 04:14 PM (EST)

Hi Dan,excuse me for not anwering earlier, I'm sitting a couple of time zones away, actually...OK, yes, I'll try to go in depth a bit:The .con files in your consist folder can be edited, I'd suggest using WordPad to ensure every file gets saved properly in unicode format (or MSTS will have another hick-up). About the necessity of names to be consistent:This is taken from a custom consist picked randomly from my consist folder. The filename is BCRail_GP10_Woodchipper_x10.conIf you open the file in WordPad, you'll see its first lines being as followsSIMISA@@@@@@@@@@JINX0D0t______Train (
TrainCfg ( BCRail_GP10_Woodchipper_x10
Name ( "BC Rail GP10+10 Woodc." )
MaxVelocity ( 40.00000 1.00000 )
NextWagonUID ( 11 )
Durability ( 1.00000 )
Engine (
UiD ( 1 )
EngineData ( GP10_brc "BC Rail GP10 481" )
)
Wagon (
WagonData ( wood_BCR_90711 "US Woodchipper Set3" )
UiD ( 2 )
)( ... )The important thing is that the file name itself, and the line TrainCfg ( BCRail_GP10_Woodchipper_x10must match. If you alter the filename of one consist, for example to create a CTA_Linden_2400_x8.con from a copy of the existing CTA_Linden_2400_x8a.con, then you have to edit it in WordPad afterwards and adjust the traincfg line. I think that is also one of the few instances where MSTS is picky about lower and upper case, so make that a 100% match.As for the following line, Name ( "BC Rail GP10+10 Woodc." )this is the line that you will actually see displayed in the drop down menu when you select the train you want to take for a spin. It can be anything that makes sense to you and fits into the rather small window of the "select train" window.And yes, the files come with help-files which are part of the program. ConBuilder is really easy to use, RouteRiter has some more possibilities - especially also with regard to optimizing routes per se - which makes it feel more appealing to the advanced user. Still, take your time to read through the available info, and also have a look at the FAQ section here on the forum (link see below), I think there is even some step-to-step guide on consists available somewhere down there (at least it used to be).Good luck, and just keep asking. It may take a couple of hours for the sun ticking along on CET - or Zulu minus 1 for aviation minded folks - to set over here with me (evenings are my usual MSTS time, for apparent reasons). CheersLukas a.k.a Swissie

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LAST EDITED ON Feb-28-04 AT 02:02 AM (EST)

Hi Lucas! Boy I'd like to say I understand what you're saying here but to be honest I really don't. I found something in the FAQ list about a 'Consist Editor' that is within the sim I think so I wonder if that might be of any help?? I'm going to take a look as it can't hurt to do that!! I'll also try getting on the site to get those 2 tools you mentioned and sit and look at the 'read mes' for those. I think I'll get this stuff eventually but being a beginner for doing add-ons to MSTS it's gonna take a while!! I'll let you know if I have any success here or not!! I managed to get on the site and have downloaded the 2 utilities you mentioned. I tried the 'consist editor' within the game and just went "Whaaaaa??"!! So I'll look at these others you suggested and see where to go from there!! Thanks so much for the help so far!!! Regards.... Dan G.

Dan Green

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Hi Lucas!! Well I looked at the 'Route Riter' and the 'Con Builder' and I'll have to confess that I'm totally lost man!! I think the only way I'll be able to get through this would be to have someone literally talk me thru it step by step! I may try Mcsft game help support by phone but I doubt they will help with add-on things like this. I've tried believe me but I think I may have tried something here that's a little beyond my capability!! One question if I may is when I open up TS the CTA sim opens up with 'Explore route' on top line, and you can change the # of cars etc. If I go to any of the other routes in the list then the options list (consist,weather etc.)is not usable. Could that be where I'm going wrong here?? Again THANKS VERY MUCH for trying to help me so far!!! Dan G.

Dan Green

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LAST EDITED ON Feb-28-04 AT 12:24 PM (EST)

Hi Dan,no panic, I'll try to get you some more food for thought...> If I go to any of the other routes in the list then the options list (consist,weather etc.)is not usable. Hmmm, that is not the way it should be. OK, first things first: I think we might be mixing up terms here: The Chicago Elevated (EL) is considered one route. It may have different branches or lines, which you can call "routes" in a non-technical sense, such as the red line or the circle etc. In technical terms of MSTS, a route is the complete install of scenery, tracks, roads etc for one specific surrounding. By default, MSTS comes with 6+1 routes, namelyEurope1: Settle - Carlisle
Europe2: Innsbruck - St. Anton
USA1: NEC Washington - Philadelphia
USA2: BNSF Marias Pass Whitefish - Shelby
Japan1: Odakyu RR Tokyo - Hakone
Japan2: Hisatsu RRplus Tutorial route - no prototype for that Any add-on route you download and install in your MSTS copy is one route. No matter how many branches etc. it has: Rich Garber's Ohio Rail which contains the tracks of two ficticious RR companies is still one route, despite the fact that there are two mainlines, and many branches in his route. In contrast to Flight Simulator, MSTS does not let you roam around the globe freely. The routes represent a limited stretch of track, a specific area. When you get at its end, well, that's it. Tracks end - if you are lucky you manage to stop, otherwise you derail... There is no way to simply continue, jump to another route but by closing the current "activity", exiting to the main menue, and loading a new route, with the same or a different train.Now MSTS has three different modi in which you can operate a train over each route. The first one is the "explore route" option, which just means that you can drive up and down a route at your leisure, with your train (the one you select from the drop down list) being the only one present. No timetable, no route to stick to. The signals will let you go anywhere as long as the track ahead is free. The only way to see a red light in explore mode is when you have uncoupled some cars and let them obstruct the track behind you, so that when you come back they block your path (can happed if you shunt around). The second modus is when you do any of the activities provided with a route. Note that not all route come with activities, and in such a case, the only option available for that route is "explore mode". When doing an activity, the player is bound by the settings the author of the activity has made: Start time and Weather is predefined, as is the player train. Furthermore, the player is supposed to stick to the path (your way around in the activity) and the schedule the activity designer made up. Signals will not clear for you when you try to leave the route, and automatic switches will not react to your pressing of the G-key. On the other hand, this allows the sim to run computer controlled AI traffic besides your train, again on pathes and according to a schedule the activity designer has made up. Which takes quite a lot of trial and error, until you get to know all the quirks than can stall an AI train, as the Ai is more artificial than intelligent . The third, less important mode is the "introductory train ride mode", which is basically also a pre-made activity, but with the computer effectively controlling the train while you can sit in as a passenger, without being able to take control from the AI driver. Your options are as limited as with an activity where you are in charge of the train: You cannot alter the time, weather, train, path etc. All of the default activities come with such an intro ride, most free add-on routes do not feature one. Now, just to repeat: Any route should work in the free-style explore mode. Only limitation is that MSTS will not let you select an electric motor on a route which is not electrified. Diesel and steam engines can be run on any route. Thus I am not suspecting that you did not actually go to the loading screen for one of the other routes (in MSTS terms), but did just select one of the activities of the EL route (one of the different branches) and noticed that you cannot change anything? What happens if you select another route, i.e. Marias Pass? Use explore mode and a consist powered by a diesel engine, and see if MSTS loads properly. As with regard to consists: Even if you have many add-on engines and cars installed, you cannot simply start MSTS, and select freely among your roster of engines and cars which ones you want to make up your train today. Engines and cars have to be assembled into consists first (non-technically, a consist is nothing else but the whole train, made up from one or more engines, and one or more cars). Only engines that are already in use as leading engine of at least one such consist do appear in the "select engine" window at all. And in the window to select your train to go with that engine you just selected, you will only find the consists which are led by that engine. In the case of the CTA motors for the EL route, you seem to have a number of consists installed, one with 2, 4, 6, and 8 cars, if I recall that correctly. If you wanted to drive a train with 10 CTA motors, you would first have to go into ConBuilder, and assemble 10 of those motors to your new consist, give it a name which tells you later what it is, and safe it. Open up MSTS again, and voilá, now you will also see your new train made up from 10 CTA motors.So now for the time being, just to help you familiarize yourself with ConBuilder, may I suggest you just play around a bit, trying to put together a few trains - not necessarily for the EL, you could also make up a couple "new" trains for the other routes and try them out. Such as a BNSF Dash9 pulling some NEC passenger coaches, or the HHP8 struggling with a freight train of some 50+ freight cars... Just be aware that you should not (or cannot) mix cars & engines with chain and automated couplers, indicated by letters (A) or (C) in the list of engines/cars in ConBuilder. Note also that you can either have ConBuilder display all the engines in the left hand window, or just steam, diesel, or electric stuff, and similarily, you can use the right hand window to either display all the cars (awfully long list) or just passenger carriages, freight cars or tenders. Apart from that, I am pretty sure that you should get the hang of using ConBuilder rather fast, it is not as complicated as it might sound, actually Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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Hello Lucas! I must really apologize Lucas for my being so very slow with this stuff!! What you said in your last reply was well to be honest I didn't understand it. I'm very sorry! I looked again at the 'Con-Builder' and again I just had no clue at all what to do!! Looking at the help section did not help either as I had no concept of what was being said. So with that in mind at least for now I'm going to back away from this project and go back to my 'Flight Simming' for a while. I may come back to the 'EL Trains' at a later date and try again but there's no sense continuing on and getting very frustrated and upset over something that should be fun and enjoyable!!! I hope you understand and I do THANK you very much for trying to be of help to me!! In the mean time I do intend to try and read up on the Con Builder and RouteRiter stuff and see if I can try and understand it better!! Again I apologize but for now I need to back away from this and come back at a later time and try again!! Talk to you later! Regards.... Dan Green

Dan Green

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Hi Dan,> something that should be fun and enjoyableOh yes, MSTS sometimes has the potential for frustration... On the other hand, once one gets the hang of it - and the learning curve might be steep sometimes, I agree - most people find out that MSTS offers a lot of room for individual creations, such as routes, engines & cars, activities, repaints, etc etc. Happy landings in the meantime Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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Hi Lucas!! I hope I didn't sound like I was giving up cause I'm not!! I had much the same thing with FS when I got started but I was lucky in that I found a person right here who could come out and help me or talk with me on the phone and take me through new stuff which really was a big help!! So a question: Where do you find the "how to" guide (manual) for the RouteRiter, or Con Builder so I have some sort of step by step guide as to what I'm supposed to be doing?? Finding that would be a great help!! Then as I can get familiar with things as you say it will start to be more fun and enjoyable!!! So I'm goona go to FS and do some landings with the new C5B Galaxy!! I'll keep pluggin away!!! Regards.... Dan G.

Dan Green

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Hi Dan,ConBuilder has a help file inside the program. Just press the button in the tool bar, that will bring up a list of topics. From there, click your way through from top to bottom.RouteRiter is more advanced in its possibilities, and thus you may find it more difficult to get into, for the simple reason that it talks about many topics the "regulars" consider daily business. Basically, it was created as tool for route authors allowing them to optimize their routes, but of course it also does a lot of helpful things for "normal users" if I may say so. It also has a help file, and clicking on "contents" in the folder window brings up the various topics. Read the route riter introduction as a starter. So I suggest you first get into ConBuilder. Remember, making consists is what that tool is for in the first place, and consists are the "assembled" trains (loco, wagons) you drive around with. But apart from making consists, it can also check for errors with consists and the parts they are made up from (engines and cars).That'll be lesson one, so off to you againCheers, and put that C-5 down safely Lukas a.k.a Swissie

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Hello Lucas!! Well a few things have happened. I did look at the help areas on both of those tools and frankly I could not get much out of them. For instance in the Con Builder when you have the screen open and you add 'locomotives/wagons' and you see the images at the bottom then I'm lost as to what am I doing with this!! I mean I can't figure out where to go or what to do to add "linden motors" as the error msg. reads! Am I making any sense here?? Frankly the help sections does not help me much there!! In the mean time I called MS Game Help and talked with a Tech. Support rep and based on the error messages I was getting he felt that the El Train add-on had missing or corrupt files and had me uninstall/reinstall TS so now I'm back to square 1 for sure!! So how could I determine if the 'El Train' files I have are bad or not?? Also the Rep. was going to send me a step by step procedure for adding routes/trains and I'm waiting for this in my E-mail. So this is where I'm at for now. I also had sent a request for help on this to Chris at Cykworks and so far no response from him at all. So now I'll wait and see what the Tech. Rep. sends me and or if this guy Chris would respond!! I'm also more than open to any thoughts you may have on this since I'm now back to the beginning it's very possible I installed the whole thing wrong in the first place!! Anyway if you have any thoughts I'd welcome them!! My E-mail if you want: Felixgreen180@msn.com or I'll keep an eye on the forum also!! Again THANKS VERY MUCH for all your help so far!! Regards... Dan Green P.S. I did fairly good with the C5!! I got a bit low on approach, and landed a little left of centerline but not too bad!!

Dan Green

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Dan, You have mail. My Computer specs are in my profile
Mike
"

This Smile says it all"

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I would like to know where to get the software and other pieces to load onto my pc.Thank you,hawker

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Say Dan did you ever get the problems fixed on the Chicago El?? I'm having the same problem also. If so let me know.Cliff Stamper

Stamper

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Hello Cliff! Sorry to say no I did not get the 'El-Trains' fixed and I had done a un-install/re-install, so now I do not have the El-trains in my sim presently. I have the zip files sitting in my 'junk/trains' folder for a future use. I just could not figure out what to do to get the activity working even with lots of advise from other people!! I could not figure out the 'RouteRiter', nor the 'Con Builder' utilities but with the help of one person I was able to use the 'Consist Editor' that is within the Sim and I even managed to add a new Steam Engine and train. I'm kinda not sure about trying that with the El Train add-on!! I'm hoping that Chris at Cykworks will maybe put out a better easier to use version of the El Train sim in the near future!! It's not any fun to be trying to get something to work properly and when it won't you can't figure out what to do to fix the issue!! Anyway if you should have any success with the El Trains please let me know and I may just try using it again!! Sorry I couldn't help you out!! My E-mail if you wish is: Felixgreen180@msn.com . Regards.... Dan Green

Dan Green

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Okay Dan. Maybe I can e-mail chris he help me out with version 1 will let you know if I was sucessfulCliff Stamper

Stamper

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Hi Guys,Sorry to have jumped into the middle of your ongoing conversation, but I have something that MIGHT help out here.I just got done downloading and installing another engine that came with a consist. The consist showed up in ConBuilder, found no problems with the engine files or consists, BUT when I tried to load it into the Sim, the Sim never loaded the engine. After much investigation, I found a problem INSIDE the consist file itself. Not enough for ConBuilder to fail to load it, but enough for the Sim to fail to recognize it. Now, if you already have an engine that will load into the Sim (and it must have one MSTS valid consisst to do so), the engine would seem OK. Your problem comes when you try to use a different consist.Try this. Go into ConBuilder and load the problem consist, the one that was named in the error message. Then click on SAVE. Say YES, you want to replace the consist. Some how, ConBuilder, when it saves/resaves a file, removed/cleaned- up the MSTS problem. In my case, the Sim NOW recognized the consist as valid, and used it. (It appears that in MY case, someone went into the original consist file and did some changing by hand.)Hope this solves your problem. Let us know if it does.Good luck.
Ted

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