Making SOUND SOURCES Work

Trying SOUND SOURCES in my TEST Route, I have selected a "Church Bells Loop" Sound, I can hear when in the Route Editor but not in the Route, neither from inside the Driver's Cab nor Outside ! The "Milepost" is indicating the location of the Sound Source when driving along the Track. What am I not doing ?Thanks, O t t o

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RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, Fred_Huntley, Feb-13-03, 11:08 AM, (1) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, OTTODAD, Feb-13-03, 03:33 PM, (2) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, sockstuffer, Feb-13-03, 08:26 PM, (3) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, OTTODAD, Feb-14-03, 08:08 AM, (5) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, Fred_Huntley, Feb-13-03, 10:34 PM, (4) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, OTTODAD, Feb-14-03, 08:19 AM, (6) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, Fred_Huntley, Feb-14-03, 11:42 AM, (7) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, OTTODAD, Feb-14-03, 01:57 PM, (8) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, Fred_Huntley, Feb-14-03, 02:12 PM, (9) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, OTTODAD, Feb-14-03, 02:53 PM, (10) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, scefhwil, Feb-17-03, 08:29 AM, (11) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, Fred_Huntley, Feb-17-03, 11:23 AM, (12) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, scefhwil, Feb-17-03, 12:27 PM, (13) RE: Making SOUND SOURCES Work, Fred_Huntley, Feb-17-03, 12:52 PM, (14)

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If you would please post the contents of the .sms file for the Sound Source in question, I think it would help me help you solve the problem. Thanks.I assume that you have your sound quality sliders set to the maximum setting in the MSTS Options.

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Fred,it is the Church_r.sms. Plays perfectly in the RE.Thanks for looking into it.O t t o
===============================================================Tr_SMS (Skip (mono loop & spot ) ScalabiltyGroup( 3
Activation (
ExternalCam ()
Distance (500)
)
Deactivation (
PassengerCam ()
CabCam ()
Distance (500)
)
Volume ( 1.0)
Streams ( 1
Stream (
Priority ( 2 )
Triggers ( 2
Random_Trigger ( Delay_Min_Max ( 0 3600 ) Volume_Min_Max ( 0.7 1.0 )
StartLoop ( 1
File ( "obj_summer1.wav" -1 )
SelectionMethod ( RandomSelection )
)
)
)
)
)
)
)

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Surely a master Computer Builder and Programmer with all those degrees can figure it out...The_Sock_Stuffer

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Son, you had better consider what you say and how you say if you want to stay in this Forum. O t t o

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Well, this turned interesting. The only difference between the Sound Source “church.sms” and “church_r.sms” is some sort of delay, imposed by this line:Random_Trigger ( Delay_Min_Max ( 0 3600 ) Volume_Min_Max ( 0.7 1.0 )
I placed the Sound Source “church_r.sms on a route, next to the Explore Route start point. I waited approximately 40 minutes, and then the church bells started ringing. I changed the 3600 to 90. I started MSTS again, this time it took about 38 seconds for the church bells to start. I changed the 90 to 45, and it took 16 seconds for the bells.Now you know as much as I do.If you just want bells, you can use the church.sms and it will be fine. It’s called Church Bells – Loop in my ssource.dat file.If you want to help figure this out, be my guest. I thought I’d experiment a bit more to see why KUJU did that. I thought maybe they were considering a switching function where the sound would come on (delayed) and later switch off. If you had a long stop in a town, you might not want the bells ringing continuously.

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Fred,thanks for saving me a lot of time trying to figure this out the hard way. Will also have a look into Teemu's N.&.J.C. which is full of all sorts of Sounds.What I am trying to achieve is to create a Sound Source which, placed close to the Tracks Crossing part of Switches/Points and Crossings, instantly triggers a sound as closely as possible to the Real "Going over Switches" one.RailWaves got me started and Okrasa advised further, but covering a whole Switch with a Sound Region is not accurate enough, especially when approaching it from both directions ! O t t o

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I may go back an re-visit my feeble attempts to do the same. I ended up making Sound Regions to do the Points sounds. I'm very pleased with the results, except the Sound Regions have a bad habit of wandering around if you make any changes to the track.Pictured below is Dave Mewhinney's Mesaba Electric Route, and the sounds of steel wheels crashing over steel rails is reproduced quite well. I used a recording of a Chicago Transit Authority rapid transit train I made on a fantrip. In this location, the Sound Region is very stable, but there are other places on the route where the Sound Regions just get up and move around, usually after a change in the track arrangement somewhere. The track change can be anywhere on the route, and some of the Sound Regions several tiles away will move. This one has never moved. I'm still looking for a common element.But, as you say, a Sound Source may be the answer. It will have to be speed controlled so that the loop stops playing if you should happen to stop on the switch/points.

Attachments

http://www.train-sim.com/dcforum/User_files/3e4d1c335be91fb6.jpg

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Yes Fred, you are thinking along the same lines.I like the older railway tracks sound that comes with the RailWaves. Perfect for the P.O.&.N and N.&.J.C. Routes.I find that one of the problems with a Sound Region covering a Large Radius Point is that it is playing for too long. Restricting it to the "Frog" only does not work. I think it was Mike Vone or the Aussie "How-to Manuals" Site saying that it has to cover the entire Point beyond it's joints with the next track pieces. And if you drive into it from the Blades end, which usually produces very little if any sound on modern high-speed tracks, it goes on and on ! Reversing through a Point creates another problem.I was thinking of doing what you did and record real live point sounds from the outside and with the permission of the local Railway Company, from inside a Driver's Cab. Then pick the best sequences with my wav files editor, adjusting Volume and Duration of play to suit. Then it should be just a case of triggering it to play that Sound Source sequence just once, the .sms deciding whether it is an Inside or Outside sound ? Not like the "Looping Bells" I used only because I could not hear the "Random" one at all ! This has been one of the more popular items on many MSTS "Wishlists" ! Could be wasting our time trying to do it now if KUJU obliges ? I sincerely hope so ! O t t o

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Below is a preliminary .sms file, it needs some more work. I could not get the loop to stop with the Frequency statement, so I put in a PlayOneShot. The PlayOneShot works fine, except if you plan to watch the train with the #4 camera, in which case, you would want the points loop to repeat.You can use your "points.wav", renaming it as needed. Or you can substitute any of the MSTS rail joint sounds. I tried steam_joint11.wav, and it was OK, but the volume was a little low.The distance is set for 10 meters, which seemed about right in my tests. You may want to increase/decrease depending on your track speeds. You would also need to change Variable_Trigger number and the first column of numbers in the VolumeCurve statement to match your distance.You can also change the ScalabilityGroup to 5, and then it won't load if the Sound options in MSTS are below the maximum.
SIMISA@@@@@@@@@@JINX0x1t______Tr_SMS ( ScalabiltyGroup ( 3
Activation (
ExternalCam ( )
CabCam ( )
PassengerCam( )
Distance ( 10 )
)
Deactivation (
Distance ( 10 )
)
Volume ( 1.0 )
Streams ( 1
Stream (
Priority ( 2 )
Triggers ( 2
Variable_Trigger ( Distance_Dec_Past 10 PlayOneShot ( 1 File
( "points.wav" -1 )
SelectionMethod ( RandomSelection ) ) )
Variable_Trigger ( Distance_Inc_Past 10
ReleaseLoopRelease ( ) ) ) FrequencyCurve (
SpeedControlled
CurvePoints ( 3
-200.0 60000
30.0 0
200.0 60000
)
Granularity ( 100 )
)
VolumeCurve(
DistanceControlled
CurvePoints ( 3
0.0 1.0
5.0 0.5
10.0 0.0
)
Granularity ( 0.01 ) ) ) ) ) )

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Brill Fred !I shall give that a try.Thanks, O t t o

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Just a few observations.The Distance () statements in the Activation and Deactivation sections refer to the distances between the camara position and the sound source position at which the sms goes from dummy status to active status, ie becomes audible. If these are the same as the Distances used in trigger statements then at high speed the sms can start to not play the sounds. So it might be better to have the Act/deact Distances at something like 50m or maybe even 100m.You don't need a ReleaseLoopRelease statement after a PayOneShot as there is no loop to stop.The Distance used in the VolumeCurves is also the camara to sound source distance. This is therefore measured in any direction, not just along the track (unless that happens to be where the camara is). With Cab and Pas views this isn't such a problem, but with external views it does result in the sound triggering well before/after the loco passes the sound source if your camara position is well head or aft the loco along the track alignment. This also means that if you have a double track with a point only on one track (to say a passing loop) and you place such a sound source on it you will also hear it when running past on the adjacent track (the one without the point) if your camara position passes within, in your case, 10m of it. ie inside the cab.These side effects are unfortunately due to the way the sms system works, and so I recon we just have to live with them.

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Scefhwil, thanks for the insight. It may help me fix this thing. I has some good results putting the sound in a yard, but as you point out, approaching it at high speed doesn't produce the desired results. I'll adjust the Distance (10) top maybe 50 and run some more tests. It might be that I need to design one for yards (low speed) and another for the main line.The ReleaseLoopRelease statement is left over from trying StartLoop versus PlayOneShot. I've been trying each one to see which sounds better.Yes there will be a tradeoff for the camera views. If the darn Sound Regions would stay put, I'd use them. They produce the best results. I might try the Sound Regions again, and when they are correct, figure out a way of backing up and restoring the .ws files.I do have a question that you may be able to answer: I was using the same .wav file for the Sound Source and the Sound Region. The Sound Region produces a much louder sound than the Sound Source. I was thinking that it might be because the VolumeCurve statement might still be ramping the sound up by the time I hit the 0 Distance setting, so it never got to full volume. Any thoughts?

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Sound Sources and the Sound Regions.In the Global folder is a file called soundcfg.dat. At the bottom of this is a line (I can't recall it off hand) that has ( 1.0 0.4 ) parameters by default. This controls the overall maximum levels of sound the first being for train related sounds, the second for environment related sounds. As you'll note this suggests that environment sounds have a forced upper volume limit of only 40% that of the train sounds! (Why!!!! Couldn't KUJU just have done it all in the individual sms's?). (I have mine increased to 0.6 but this can produce some over loud environment sounds on some routes, so I wouldn't recommend this as a general tweak). Anyway, Sound Sources are definitely environment sounds, so maybe Sound Regions are classed as train sounds?

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Ah ha! More insight.I've been trying to leave the soundcfg.dat at the default settings. I figured that if I got this working right, it could be released to the Library, or even just posted here as a zip. But it wouldn't do much good if the average Joe Trainsim has to tweak the soundcfg.dat file to get it to work right.But, I'll try messing with it for my own purposes. Thanks.

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