Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so let's

LAST EDITED ON Jun-13-04 AT 08:20 PM (EDT)

Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so let's quit the name calling. It ain't gonna help the forum if we start to slide into this area it it?Also all forum members should take note that there are now adult members of this forum who have learning difficulties, now I realize that not all of us can tell immediately from the 10/11-year-old brat who needs his ass slapped and the genuine guy who does need our help.Bradhig admits to having learning difficulties and is 31 years old. Let me reassure you Bradgig THAT YOU ARE NOT AN IDIOT. I on the hand am an idiot: I have re-installed MSTS more times than you have had hot dinners, I forget to do this and I forget to do that. Why? cos I'm an idiot. I know this cos my dad use to call me idiot boy and get out of my sight idiot boy.so guys let's be least civil to one another so we can live for another day.Mike

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Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so let's [View All], sinclair97, 08:20 PM, Jun-13-04, (0) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, Richard, Jun-13-04, 09:35 PM, (1) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, heffed, Jun-13-04, 09:43 PM, (2) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, ssw_96, Jun-13-04, 10:16 PM, (3) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, zachattack, Jun-13-04, 10:32 PM, (4) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, sinclair97, Jun-13-04, 11:42 PM, (5) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, kevarc, Jun-13-04, 11:57 PM, (6) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, gatewaycityca, Jun-14-04, 03:41 AM, (13) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, McCloud_River_John, Jun-14-04, 00:09 AM, (7) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, chucksc, Jun-14-04, 00:41 AM, (8) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, ASR_Q301, Jun-14-04, 00:56 AM, (9) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, LAHDPOP, Jun-14-04, 01:00 AM, (10) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, BNSF4723, Jun-14-04, 02:47 AM, (11) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, LAHDPOP, Jun-14-04, 02:58 AM, (12) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, sinclair97, Jun-14-04, 06:14 AM, (14) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, OTTODAD, Jun-14-04, 07:26 AM, (15) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, Cworth, Jun-14-04, 08:17 AM, (16) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, ASR_Q301, Jun-14-04, 08:37 AM, (17) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, kevarc, Jun-14-04, 09:28 AM, (18) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, BNSFLADY, Jun-14-04, 11:55 AM, (20) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, sinclair97, Jun-14-04, 02:39 PM, (21) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, kevarc, Jun-14-04, 03:04 PM, (22) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, sinclair97, Jun-14-04, 03:23 PM, (23) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, DJShepley, Jun-14-04, 03:37 PM, (24) RE: Hey guys we need to be civil to one another, so le, bradhig, Jun-14-04, 10:08 AM, (19)

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Mike,
I agree. Also I like to thank Brad for being honest. I also wish to apologize if I made him feel bad, it was not my intent. I was trying to figure out where he was coming from Maybe my terminology is a little out of date, but what I said was not meant to be hurtful of disrespectful. The hardest thing about these forums, we only receive about 5% of the true message. We loose tone, content and body language, so to often we misinterpret the message. Again, Brad if my message upset you, I apologize, that was not my intent.
I'd also like to add; Brad, there is nothing wrong at all with you liking Disney stuff, Walt was a huge railfan. That is why all his amusement parks feature trains, plus he had a very large live steam railroad at his estate.Take care,
Rich S.

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Well said. -Jeff

Union Pacific fan.

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Say there Mike, well said on that. Also did you get my e-mail response.

The best railroad there ever was

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> I'd also like to add; Brad, there is nothing wrong at all
>with you liking Disney stuff, Walt was a huge railfan.
And he nearly bought (in my opinion, "stole" ) the only steamer in my area. Richard is right, there is nothing wrong with liking Disney stuff. That's no problem.

Zach Lybrand

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Thanks for the positive response guys.Richard,
I really appreciate your response, and even though you apologized, I actually didn't have you in mind when I posted(I suppose because I knew that you were one of the good guys).No, I was thinking of someone else who I have yet to see say anything nice to anybody or anything, or make some kind of gesture that could be interpreted as being a positive contribution to this forum, and whose liberal use of the word "idiot" has now angered others (to the extent that posts are locked). I also understand that this individual makes no secret of having an open contempt for this forum: I quote a remark made in another forum " made a post to the Train-sim forum today. Shudder." This forum is made up of ordinary people: we are the forum; hence the contempt for us.You will never find this guy actively engaged in intelligent discussion, nor will you ever find him apologizing even for a misunderstanding.I'm sorry if I have caused offense to anyone ,but I was getting more and more depressed the way the guy used you the forum like a public urinal.Mike

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Why don't you just say it was me? I really don't give a $hit what you or anyone else thinks. Did I know that when I made my post? No. Do I feel I need to apologize? NO. I made my statement at the time and I stay with it. I made my staement with the facts at hand.I have helped far more people than you think. Unlike you, I try to keep things simple and not way over engineered.For the record:
I HAVE contributed to the FAQ's
I HAVE assisted many people, many through emails and PM's. I don't keep track of that, bean counts are meaningless, as are posts about how many timesI have posted. I never even keep track of how many times my stuff as been downloaded, I don't care. That is meaningless, at least to me. If one person downloaded it and enjoyed it then I am satisfied.
I HAVE done a lot of work on files so that other do NOT have to muddle trough upgrading the physics AND made them available for FREE.
I have done a lot of work in the AE and found a few things out that I have shared, well most of it, gotta keep a couple of things up my sleeve.
I DO call them as I see them, I really do not care what others may think. If I am wrong, I am wrong and freely admit it. Look around, you will find them. Again, I don't keep track of things like that. I have better things to do.
I do HAVE comtempt and loathing for many on this forum. You are a prime example of that. DEAL WITH IT!Kevin Arceneaux
DEFAULT IS FOR DUMMIES
Cry havoc and Let slip the dogs of war.
It's fun being CRAZY!!!!!
Lone Wolf Activities Forum and Activity Packs are on www.3DTrains.com

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I guess there might be a long history here we don't know about, but still...I've been on here a lot longer than my number of posts shows. Probably about when I first got MSTS, and I got it right about when it came out in 2001. I had to set up a new name a couple of times because I hadn't been on in a while and my screen name and password wasn't valid anymore. Anyway, I haven't personally had any problems with any of the forums. In fact, I've found most people on here to be very friendly. (especially the Route Design and Traction forums). But then I haven't felt any need to try to put anyone down either. I don't feel any need (nor do I see any point in) "calling what I see." If you don't agree with someone, discuss it, and then if that doesn't work just ignore them. I don't see how anyone can be just SO good at MSTS or anything else for that matter that you have to put up with a bad personality along with it when you deal with them. Again, I've never run into that with anyone here. But it is something we should keep in mind...none of us are THAT good that we have the implied right to treat other people bad. So I can tell you that I will continue to be civil.

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Mike, Kevin tells it as he sees it, sorry if sometimes it stings. Take a look at his forum on 3D Trains, numerous uploads in the library and tell then that he doens't contribute back to everyone here. Christ, he has helped me countless times.He is the only one I know that is brave enough to call and "idiot" an "idiot".
Now I have to get back to figuring out how to get the turntable to work.John

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LAST EDITED ON Jun-14-04 AT 00:52 AM (EDT)

>He is the only one I know that is brave enough to call and
>"idiot" an "idiot". John The "only one" ???????? Possibly you are forgetting Me or Sniper or Don Shepley to name a few of the "Band of Mean Old Men" ???? LOL!Kevin is a bit tart at times but he does good work....And I enjoy "fencing with him"......
Chuck Schneider
Chief Cook, Bottle Washer and (Virtual) CEO

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The request to be civil is turning into a civil war!!I am not going to lock this (YET), because I feel it is mearly people expressing thier opinions, not a flame war!But please guys (EVERYONE!!), just keep it civil in here!!>Mike Forster<
Perth, Western Australiapacificnational_nr103@hotmail.com
http://www.trainweb.org/aussiepix

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Piss off, Mike. You're the one who posted those lame-ass pictures of chess pieces being hit by a train. What the hell was the point of that? So we'd take your future posts more seriously? Not bloody likely. Maybe you ought to take the short bus, too.And about Brad. Who says he has a disability? Him??? I'm not saying he doesn't, because I have no idea, but I sure as hell wouldn't just take his word for it. If we believed everyone on here that tried for special attention by whining "poor me," we'd all be out looking for runaway horses and dying mothers while watching a freaking 10-yr old drive the Big Boy across Nebraska. Everyone on here deserves EQUAL treatment. Equal politeness when warranted, and equal "Shut the hell up" when warranted, especially about the freakin Supertrain.

Bret

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"But please guys (EVERYONE!!), just keep it civil in here!!"..."Piss off, Mike"LOL. Thats society for ya.

Cedarbrae RR - A fictional railroad in rural lands. Coming soon.

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Note that I was replying to Mike Sinclair, not Mike Forster. I guess that one's got the potential to be mis-read, doesn't it?

Bret

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NO I SHALL NOT. INTIMIDATION DOES NOT WORK ON MEI expressed a legitimate concern without resorting to abuse about an individual's open contempt for the forum and its members.There is a small group of people here who use verbal abuse as a method of intimidation to try and control other members in this forum: they are, in a word, bullies who will quite happily use this forum as a public urinal if it suits their purposes.Everyone has the right to express his or her opinion without the fear of having to brave those scornful and disparaging one-liners.Mike

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It does not matter who you replied to, Bret, what does is that many of us civilised people in this Forum object to that sort of language and to guys being asked by Admins not to use it continuing doing so !Too many are already staying away from the Fora for that very reason !O t t o

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LAST EDITED ON Jun-14-04 AT 08:24 AM (EDT)

(A) - Users shall not post or transmit material through these forums that:
violates or infringes the rights of another (such as the unauthorized posting of trademarks, copyrighted material, and the like);threatens, abusives, defames, or otherwise attacks another (such as through sociological, geographical, political, financial, or religious attacks);contains profanity, vulgarity, or other obscenities;
contains pornography or pornographic language; OR
spams or otherwise has the effect of a mass advertisement or mailing.
The aforementioned may be more easily understood from the following analogy--Imagine yourself being invited into OUR home. We have invited guests from around the world to join in. Each of these guests come from different sociological, geographical, political, financial, and religious backgrounds. We will supply the place in which to gather, but please understand that all of the guests here are our friends. If one comes in here and insults our other guests, pick fights, is rude, or generally disrupts the flow of our gathering, they will be asked to tone it down or leave. The rest of us just want to converse. However, this does not mean that our guests can't debate like adults (i.e. with respect and thoughtfulness). This also does not mean that our guests have to agree on everything, but again just act like an adult that has been invited into someone else's home! This is right from the forums rules.The way I see it you cannot allow these certain individuals to completely feel they can do and say whatever they darn well please without worry of punishment by the admin or the moderators.
From the short time I have been here I have seen nothing done about any of the constant abuse of members on this board by said group of individuals.Whats the point of even having moderators or an admin if they will not even enforce their own rules.Something needs to be done to stop this kind of behavior.Banning,revoking posting privlages for a set amount of time,anything but at least do something other than just locking the threads.
I admit that I have posted some harsher words in a couple threads but NEVER have I directly attacked anyone except maybe by saying I disagreed with how they handled a certain situation.I posted within the rules of this forum and others should be expected to do so as well.

Visit my forum at http://s8.invisionfree.com/Railfans_Depot

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LAST EDITED ON Jun-14-04 AT 08:39 AM (EDT)

Come on guys!!!!Watch your language!! I know 3 year olds that have better manners than some people on these forums!! If this continues to "tumble-down-hill"...Brad or I will lock this!>Mike Forster<
Perth, Western Australiapacificnational_nr103@hotmail.com
http://www.trainweb.org/aussiepix

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You know something Bret? This is the ONLY board I have problems with. Most of them either keep the kiddies in line or they are history, or the boards, woodworking in particular, have NO kiddies. See a common thread?Yep, never take what a person states on this or any board as FACT. Esp. about themselves.And to gatecity or whatever - that is the way I am. I have never been shy about expressing myself or my opinions. If you have been around as long as you state, you ought to know that by now.Nels has let the kiddies run rampant for so long that it would be impossible for the mods to stop it.
Kevin Arceneaux
DEFAULT IS FOR DUMMIES
Cry havoc and Let slip the dogs of war.
It's fun being CRAZY!!!!!
Lone Wolf Activities Forum and Activity Packs are on www.3DTrains.com

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Michael:
I don’t normally get involved in this type of thread, but this is one post I have to respond to. Although you did not identify the person, I immediately presumed that you were referring to Kevin. He obviously thinks so to. Kevin is my friend, as you and many others here are. I gleaned information from this forum daily for over two years before getting brave enough to register and post. Kevin has contributed much to Train-Sim. Others have listed his contributions, so I will not list them here. He has also created a physics forum where the discussions are intelligent and informative. It is also free of the “why does everybody hate me” type of post. He has helped me many times via private messages and e-mails as he has done for so many others. I think that Kevins problem ( and mine ) are that many of the posts are redundant and produces a certain amount of frustration when reading them. Many, if not most of questions have been answered many times. Granted, the majority of posts are from people who are new to the game and this forum. There are many other parts of this site that have tons of information available. You just have to poke around. You said that this forum is made up of ordinary people: we are the forum; hence the contempt for us. This statement implies that Kevin feels that he is superior to us and looks down upon us. I can assure you this is not true. Folks may get that impression from some of his one line or one word postings. That is frustration coming through. Many times I have been tempted to respond to a post as Kevin responds. He vents his frustrations in posting his opinion, I vent mine in other ways. The purpose of a forum is to freely express opinions, ideas, and thoughts. It is also to offer rebuttal to those who disagree with the stated opinions. A while back this forum was at a low point and I frankly had serious doubts about its value in the future. Fortunately it has come back to a semblance of civility. Some of the posts made to this forum are not tolerated on others. They are deleted to prevent long useless threads such as those that sometimes develop here. You yourself have made postings that have resulted in controversy. The problem is that this forumis made up of men, women, and children of different cultures, who have different viewpoints, different sense of humor, different languages. We can hear what a person is saying, but sometimes we can not see what they are saying since text strips away emotions. As an example, your recent photos depicting the mods has chess pieces on tracks. I looked upon it as an attempt to inject some humor into the forum. I took it this way because I feel I know you through our many e-mails. Others took a different view because they don’t know you as I do. It is the same with Kevin, I love him & his personality and would gladly adopt him. He is a true friend as you are. In that vein I hope this rebuttal has not damaged our friendship in any way.Cyndi

Am I the only 1 who loves BNSF Great Pumpkin 38s?

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Hi Cyndi,
Initially after some reservations, and after some careful thought, I am pleased you have a very strong link with Kevin, and he with you.In you he has a protector, a fairy godmother, and an angel even. And Yes, I do value you as you value him.The problem for me is I now feel compromised in that I now must condone, overlook, and continue to accept what I can only describe as an attitude problem in the way kevin treats some people. Are you suggesting Cyndi some kind of compromise where we, the forum members, can disagree, but with some civility and without abuse? The need to redress this problem of "apparent" contempt has only come about in the last few weeks during which time Kevin has made more and more frequent postings that increasingly "appeared" to give the impression of contempt. I also hope you realize that I am not the only one in the forum presented with that impression.To illustrate this by way of contrast I would say members like Bret, and Chris, who, in spite of their terms of endearment towards me, do not leave me feeling cold as Kevin does; and moreover, to their credit, do not generally rub people up the wrong way. That all said I do not wish to engender any potential further enmity towards anyone as I have made my point without abuse.Had my general intentions not been well known to the moderators including Nels I would not have put my tongue-in-cheek photo shot into the forums. Although they themselves would know that it was quite harmless (as its intention), I apologize (Yes apologize)in advance to anyone who might of been offended by it, and I can also assure them that absolutely no hidden malcontent was ever intended.Mike

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Cyndi - thank you for the kind words.Mike - Cyndi is a friend. She is NOT my protector, fairy godmother, etc. If you do not know the difference, look it up. There is no "impression" of contempt. It is real. And I do know that others share this with you. Again, do I care? NO!Most everything you have done is an attempt to reinvent the wheel. However, your efforts have fallen more than short. You have over-complicated things to the point that it would be a total PITA to use. While I think DOS is dead, leave it to those that know what they are doing, Mike and Otto are two good examples. Your efforts to do something remind me of the kid who tries anything to be included, but is not in the class of those that can. I have taken my lumps here for things I have done with my first activity and crappy readmes in my early packs, but unlike you I have learned from my mistakes and improved on my releases.Friends, unlike relatives, you can choose. I don't want to be friends with everyone. Kevin Arceneaux
DEFAULT IS FOR DUMMIES
Cry havoc and Let slip the dogs of war.
It's fun being CRAZY!!!!!
Lone Wolf Activities Forum and Activity Packs are on www.3DTrains.com

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Kevin,I accept your criticismMike

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Mike,I am not an apologist for Kevin...he is my Friend and his many kindnesses and assistance are most appreciated. No rules are required to restrict unseemly and ungentlemanly conduct...it is really a quite simple matter od doing unto others as you would have them do unto you!

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That's why the parks have monorails as well.

Supertrain coming to train sim someday.

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