Alco's- prime movers

Technical question - what makes the alco prime movers sound so distinctive?
Sincerely,
Shawn Kenselaar
ShawnSSK@Yahoo.com

Train-sim.com Lifer and Screen Shot Forum Mod
Repainter for YLW & TKW

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

RE: Alco's- prime movers, chucksc, Apr-23-03, 05:20 PM, (1) RE: Alco's- prime movers, sd70mac666, Apr-23-03, 06:21 PM, (2) RE: Alco's- prime movers, chucksc, Apr-23-03, 09:28 PM, (3) RE: Alco's- prime movers, ssw_96, Apr-23-03, 09:54 PM, (4) RE: Alco's- prime movers, sooner, Apr-23-03, 11:43 PM, (5) RE: Alco's- prime movers, Chessie SD50 8563, Apr-24-03, 05:01 AM, (6) RE: Alco's- prime movers, gbel2001, Apr-24-03, 07:53 AM, (7) RE: Alco's- prime movers, sooner, Apr-24-03, 08:17 AM, (8) RE: Alco's- prime movers, sooner, Apr-24-03, 07:14 PM, (9) RE: Alco's- prime movers, Coonskin, Apr-24-03, 08:03 PM, (10) RE: Alco's- prime movers, sooner, Apr-24-03, 11:41 PM, (12) RE: Alco's- prime movers, Coonskin, Apr-25-03, 10:31 AM, (14) RE: Alco's- prime movers, sooner, Apr-25-03, 11:22 AM, (16) RE: Alco's- prime movers, Coonskin, Apr-25-03, 02:46 PM, (19) RE: Alco's- prime movers, sooner, Apr-25-03, 05:07 PM, (20) RE: Alco's- prime movers, rdfox, Apr-24-03, 09:18 PM, (11) RE: Alco's- prime movers, CRSD40, Apr-25-03, 10:14 AM, (13) RE: Alco's- prime movers, Coonskin, Apr-25-03, 10:36 AM, (15) RE: Alco's- prime movers, CRSD40, Apr-25-03, 01:10 PM, (17) RE: Alco's- prime movers, Coonskin, Apr-25-03, 02:41 PM, (18) RE: Alco's- prime movers, ATF1224, Apr-25-03, 09:47 PM, (21) RE: Alco's- prime movers, Gixxer86g, Apr-26-03, 06:46 AM, (22) RE: Alco's- prime movers, CRSD40, Apr-26-03, 10:06 AM, (23) RE: Alco's- prime movers, IcyFire, Apr-26-03, 10:36 AM, (24) RE: Alco's- prime movers, CRSD40, Apr-26-03, 11:55 AM, (25)

Conferences | Topics | Previous Topic | Next Topic

They are 4 cycle mostly turbocharged like GE's FDL series....Chuck Schneider
(Virtual) CEO
North American (Virtual) Locomotive Works

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

don't forget the belching
BNSF Detector Milepost 666.
No defect
Train Speed 66.6mph
Axle Count: 666
Ambient Temperature 66.6 degrees
outI'm otherwise known as the SatanTrain

Hey everybody it's Dr. Satan
The boogie Man is real and you found him

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

LOL I forgot the out of tune part....
Actually I think that was their induction system (turbo and injectors) which was no where near as reliable/sophisticated as the GEs....Chuck Schneider
(Virtual) CEO
North American (Virtual) Locomotive Works

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Dont forget that they could also smoke like a bon fire. But the distinctive chugging was a signature in the alco series. Especially the 244 engine. A modern day sounding alco to me is the SD-90MAC-II.
UP 8522-8561 with the ugly cab. The remind me of alcos, looks and sounds.

member of http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SP_MSTS

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

So speaking of Alco sounds, I've tried to set up Gaetan Belanger's custom cab and sounds from MLW630 CPR, which he was kind enough to send me. I unzip file 2, click on MLW630 CPR exe and all I get is a window prompting "go to next file?" that won't listen to reason. Anyone else had a problem with these files?

bud

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

it actually has little to do with the ALCO turbo (which actually tends to be quite silent at times) Most the sound comes from the exhuast being blown out rapidally though the valves during the the exhuast stroke

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

LAST EDITED ON Apr-24-03 AT 07:56 AM (EDT)

Hi soonerhave you unzip the second file in the same folders of the EXE file ?what the size of your two files ? sometime bad DL corrupt files
Gaetan

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Good Morning GaetanThanks! I tried a fresh download and it went great; looking forward to trying out these sounds.

bud

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Question about these great Alco sounds: I know the PA/FA 244 had four fewer cylinders and about half the power, but does the 630 sound at all similar to it?

bud

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Bud:I don't have first hand experience with the 630's, but judging from the different sounds between other prime mover variants, I would say the 630 would definitely have a different sound from a 244.I have a sound file from the Library that I use for 244 and 251-powered Alco's that I feel is quite close (judging from the many miles I've ridden on 251's, and some 244's, as well as oft being exposed to them currently via the A&M).Downside is this sound file doesn't have nicely spaced steps. However, that shortcoming aside, these sounds are pretty stinkin' good. Plus, when using Headout or working the ground while switching, I LOVE the way it has the correct Alco "bark" when coming off idle. You'll also like the Headout sound when in Run 8.Name of the file is "alcosnd.zip".Andre

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Thanks for the steer, Andre.I found I'd downloaded "alcosnd.zip" some time ago and never got arount to trying it out! How do you have it set up? I just spent a frustrating hour or more on it: first I tried to set up alco_244 as an ordinary SOUND folder (contrary to the readme), using Don Hewitt's GN FA and FB, changing the .eng file sound lines to "alco244eng.sms" and "alco244cab.sms" which didn't work (no horns, for one thing); then I read the instructions on the boot heel, unzipping "alcosnd.zip" to "clw.sounds" to overwrite the existing alco_244 folder, and aliasing the .eng files to "clw.sounds" ("..\\..\\clw.sounds" etc.). This time I got the engine sounds, which as you say are excellent; but still no horns. Then I reviewed the the alias string used in the original CLW AlcoPA and tried that ("../../clw.sounds" etc.) and got error mss. out the scupper. So, chastised, I'm back to the New Haven sounds. I'd like to get the 244 sounds working, but as Benny Goodman said to Fletcher Henderson, where do the horns come in?

bud

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Hm. It's been a while, I went and took a look. It appears that I used the sound files from the New Haven PA package as a basis to start with. This will give you a selection of working sms files w/various horns... but with the old buzzing Alco "sound" that was okay for its time, but not now. Looks like I made copies of all the buzzing .wav files in case I goofed.Next, I replaced the engine sound .wavs within the PA sound files with the .wavs from the alcosnd.zip set. This gives me a selection of sms files w/the new Alco 244 engine sounds and different horns. In otherwords, I used the PA sound sms files and only replaced the power cruise .wav's with the new sounds from "alcosnd.zip". I didn't use the sms files that came with "alcosnd.zip", only the sound wav's.I then created a Commonsnd folder, and access the sms files as needed through that so each engine doesn't have to carry its own sound folder.Hope that works for you?I did note some oddness in my .eng files though... double lines at my sound value locations. Can't remember why it wound up that way. However, the "old" sound line is in parenthesis, so I think that makes it null and void. Perhaps I left it there in case my idea didn't work I could reactivate the former sound path by removing the parenthesis? I'm weird.BTW, those engine sounds are pretty nice, huh?Andre

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Thanks, Andre, for all your help on this. I'll try tracking your method on the 244 sound files. And yes, I was impressed with what I heard; I'd like to get these sounds working on all my F's and P's!

bud

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Bud:One more thing...I suggest placing the modified sound folder within your experimental engine first, and get it operational, accessing it directly from the .eng file. Once functional, it will be a simple matter to create (or place it in an existing) Commonsnd folder and change the sound line in the .eng file to access it.This will eliminate potential problems with the command line to access a Commonsnd folder, thus minimize trouble shooting if necessary.In otherwords, get a working sound file before using it in a Commonsnd setting.Andre

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Check. Thanks again.

bud

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

I once heard someone say that the original P40 "Genesis" locomotives sounded almost exactly like an Alco PA... anyone with a comment on that?RDF

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

LAST EDITED ON Apr-25-03 AT 10:15 AM (EDT)

Anyone know if C430's sound distinctive from other Alco's? I live near an all Alco shortline (Western New York & Pennsylvania RR), and they just bought four C430's not too long ago. Here's a couple good sites about the WNY&PRR for anyone who is interested:
(official): www.wnyprr.com
(railfan site): http://www.jamestownrailfan.net/wnyprr.html

-----------------------------

Kyle Norek, Milepost 76 on the NS Buffalo Line
MSN Messenger: crsd40@hotmail.com

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

LAST EDITED ON Apr-25-03 AT 10:37 AM (EDT)

The 430's should sound nearly identical to C420's (which are in heavy evidence near me), for they use the same basic prime mover.That so, then the "alcosnd.zip" file we're talking about up above will sound very close to them.There are some very minor differences between the sounds in the "alcosnd.zip" and a 4 axle C class, but overall, when I run one of my "alcosnd.zip" equipped Alco's up the grades of my KC&G route, memories of climbing Boston Mountain in an A&M C420 drift through my mind, so that tells me it's definitely "close enough" to get the job done.Andre

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Thanks Andre. Next question, how many C430's were built?

-----------------------------

Kyle Norek, Milepost 76 on the NS Buffalo Line
MSN Messenger: crsd40@hotmail.com

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

"Thanks Andre. Next question, how many C430's were built?" Uhhh.... eleventy-four?Andre "Haven't A Clue" Ming

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Kyle it wasn't many. I'm thinking like 16 (?) Give or take a few.Jake Mensel
___________________http://www.trainweb.org/nsrw/

"Was that a car?!?"

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

LAST EDITED ON Apr-26-03 AT 06:49 AM (EDT)

D&H C424 #74 was on the NYSW when I was there.You could hear it coming for at least a half hour climbing the mountain from Butler to Sparta.Too bad it wore Guilford colors.The 251 is considered by many sources to be one of the best prime movers to be installed in a locomotive.Unfortunately the damage was done by the time it came out.

"If you're not slidin',you're not ridin'"-Jim

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Yup, just read somewhere it is 16. BTW, here is the history of the C430's ownership: WNYP 430: ex NYSW 3000, exx Conrail 2050, exxx PC 2050, exxxx NYC 2050 WNYP 431: ex Morristown & Erie 17, exx Conrail 2053, exxx PC 2053, exxxx NYC 2053 WNYP 432: ex Morristown & Erie 16, exx Conrail 2054, exxx PC 2054, exxxx NYC 2054 WNYP 433: ex NYSW 3006, exx Conrail 2056, exxx PC 2056, exxxx NYC 2056

-----------------------------

Kyle Norek, Milepost 76 on the NS Buffalo Line
MSN Messenger: crsd40@hotmail.com

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Im still waiting for a C430 to slap some susie Q paint on
Sincerely,
Shawn Kenselaar
ShawnSSK@Yahoo.com

Train-sim.com Lifer and Screen Shot Forum Mod
Repainter for YLW & TKW

Alert | IP

Printer-friendly page | Edit | Reply | Reply With Quote | Top

Yes, a C430 model would be nice

-----------------------------

Kyle Norek, Milepost 76 on the NS Buffalo Line
MSN Messenger: crsd40@hotmail.com

Alert | IP

[ Home | MSTS Forum | MSTS FAQ | File Library ] Copyright © 2002 by Nels Anderson. All Rights Reserved.