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I just saw this on the news here in Toledo, Ohio. A Norfolk and Southern engineer was coming into the Toledo, Ohio yard at a slow speed. While passing under a foot bridge, he heard 6 shots, and a bullet when past his head and hit the engineer in the shoulder. The engineer is doing fine. It's a sad world when people shoot at other people just for fun.
Patrick

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Engineer shot [View All], ertfor3, 11:05 PM, May-10-02, (0) RE: Engineer shot, chicagorail, May-10-02, 11:17 PM, (1) RE: Engineer shot, sniper297, May-11-02, 10:32 AM, (2) RE: Engineer shot, chicagorail, May-11-02, 12:48 PM, (3) RE: Engineer shot, bcdef, May-11-02, 04:40 PM, (4) RE: Engineer shot, AJW, May-11-02, 08:06 PM, (5) RE: Engineer shot, TrainFreak, May-12-02, 02:57 AM, (6) RE: Engineer shot, chucksc, May-12-02, 08:02 AM, (7) RE: Engineer shot, slm, May-12-02, 03:21 PM, (8) RE: Engineer shot, buffy500, May-13-02, 10:48 AM, (9) RE: Engineer shot, McDeth, May-15-02, 06:40 PM, (14) RE: Engineer shot, autonerd, May-13-02, 06:14 PM, (10) RE: Engineer shot, chucksc, May-13-02, 06:27 PM, (11) RE: Engineer shot, sniper297, May-13-02, 07:06 PM, (12) RE: Engineer shot, nw_fan, May-15-02, 01:31 AM, (13) RE: Engineer shot, timchgo9, May-15-02, 11:02 PM, (15) RE: Engineer shot, CNfavorite, May-29-02, 05:07 PM, (16) RE: Engineer shot, Lone_Gunman_SG, May-29-02, 05:19 PM, (17) RE: Engineer shot, Brando, May-31-02, 12:36 PM, (18) RE: Engineer shot, AJW, May-31-02, 12:51 PM, (19)

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shooting people for absolutly no reason like that is a true sign of complete stupidity. Is anything safe anymore?

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Unfortunately jerks like that are very common. About 30 years ago I was coming home from work on the Lake St. EL, and passing the projects near Ashland one of the windows exploded showering glass all over the inside of the car. I dunno where the bullet went, but being late at night the rush hour was over, so there weren't very many of us on the train, and nobody got hurt. My favorite was when I was a kid, we were out at the forest preserves under the C&NW trestle across the Des Plaines River, and there were some other kids there throwing rocks at the passing trains. One of them whipped a rock across the river which hit the front end of a car, and with the richochet from the train's motion the rock came sailing back across the river in a high arc and nailed the punk that threw it right between the eyes. Who says there is no god?!

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haha stupid kids know who the boss is now.

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>haha stupid kids know who the
>boss is now. LOL
:D:D:D:D:D

FAMOUS HIPPIE slangs
Man-to get atension( hey man )
Chick- hippie gal, girl, woman
Dig- get it, get interseted in
Crash- sleep
Crash Pad- where one sleeps
Groovy- cool, neat, all right
Later- hippie of sayin bye
Nifty- cool, nice, sexxy!, exc
Head- a hippie!

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At one time in New York City, a few decades ago, It was considered great sport in "certain" neighborhoods to set fire to a building, then heave rocks and other lethal objects off adjacent roofs at the firemen when they arrived on the scene. No single city has a monopoly on sociopathic vermin.Anthony

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Luckily the US has had the sense to keep the death penalty

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Yep it doesn't appear to be much of a deterent! Possibly because the people who warrant it are either sociopaths (no conscience or redeeming social value at all) or "on a mission to be a martyr" or do it in a flash of uncontrollable anger or rage!
But it satisfies the societies "thurst for revenge", closure for victims' families and more importantly removes some really "bad/defective" people from the Gene Pool! (takes them off the street permanently and removes their "Breeding Option")Plus as a taxpayer I note it is significantly less expensive than life long incarceration!
------Chuck Schneider---------

-----"Power for You"-------

Chuck Schneider
(Virtual) CEO
North American (Virtual) Locomotive Works

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Well, at least us English don't get stupid things like that, might be cos we've got more sense, but I think we should have kept the death penalty, but only to be given for murder, or betrayal, depending on how bad it is.hiya
slm

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I'm not so sure we're more sensible....plenty of retarded jerks about. Try going out with your local Police on a weekend evening.
Maybe we are not as bad as some parts othe US yet, but I'm sure we will get there soon.

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whee, lets turn it into an America vs. Europe thread!

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>Plus as a taxpayer I note it is significantly less expensive
>than life long incarceration! Not to turn this into a political discussion, but no, it isn't. Appeals are more common, plus its harder to get a jury to convict when the death penalty is on the table, so the prosecution costs more $$. I remember the Arthur Shawcross (serial murderer) case, his prosecution cost the county $1 million. That was for his first trial. Imagine spending that again for a retrial on appeal. It would cost way less than that to keep him in jail for life.Besides, the death penalty doesn't work. Murder rates are consistantly higher in states with the death penalty. Drop the death penalty and per capita murders go down. I guess people see it as state-assisted suicide. Cheaper than hiring Dr. Kevorkian!

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We'll just have to agree to disagree on this!------Chuck Schneider---------

-----"Power for You"-------
http://nalw.macfall.com

Chuck Schneider
(Virtual) CEO
North American (Virtual) Locomotive Works

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I dunno if the price has changed, but feeding, guarding, health care, etc., costs about $40,000 per year per prisoner, so if he lives 30 years that would be 1.2 million, not counting inflation. Best argument against the death penalty, what if you got the wrong guy? Robert Heinlein had the best argument in favor, "The hell with deterrence, HE won't do it again!"
Back to the topic, nobody is born with morals, they have to be taught, and it's a sad fact that our society is failing in this. You used to be able to take pictures of trains from various overpasses, now they all have 20 foot high fences to stop the assholes who think dropping rocks and bricks on the windshields of cars and trains passing underneath is a fun thing to do. And of course the railroad cops are a lot quicker to arrest for tresspassing these days, since most people go in to trainyards to vandalize rather than to look and take pictures nowadays. Even the ice cream trucks have steel mesh cages over the windows, never dreamed of anything like that. So assholes randomly shooting at passing trains is no big surprise to me, hopefully there's a special corner of hell reserved for those types.

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You got that right, Sniper. For all the frustration and general pain in the ass they cause, I sure hope they get what they've got coming. It's unfortunate the way railroad photographers are treated these days, but it is understandable given the trouble the railroads have to put up with. I must say, I've had very good luck in the past with railroad employees, but I haven't been around them much in the past 5 years. It seems things are changing fast.Mike
Norfolk & Western
Precision Transportation

NORFOLK & WESTERN
Precision TransportationMike Rector
mrector@columbus.rr.com

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I have plenty of experience hanging out at the tracks, and shooting pictures. My experiences have varied. Along the Indiana Harbor Belt, at least at CP LaGrange where I shoot pictures, the IHB Police are pretty lenient if it's obvious you are a photographer (camera around the neck, tripod set up, etc.) and the some of the IHB employees are pretty nice, as well. If you are a regular around CP LaGrange, chances are the IHB, or LaGrange Police won't harrass you. It used to be years ago along the Harbor Belt, you couldn't get close enough to the tracks, or you would get busted for trespassing. However, along the UP, depending on the town, the local cops usually shag you away from the tracks (Elmhurst, Wheaton, Glen Ellyn were usually the worst) Along the BNSF, it's the same, if the cops see you there with a camera, they leave you alone. Although, in Hinsdale, post 9/11, I did get asked (politely) to leave the railroad tracks, because someone called in a "suspicious person" along the railroad tracks. Objectively, I can understand why someone would do that. My favorite spot along the BNSF is in Hinsdale, right next to Hinsdale Hospital, so there I am with camera, binoculars, and my big ol' laptop case... hmmm, I can see that looking strange... anyway, I went on my way, after explaining to the police officer what I was doing. But, after Sept 11, it's reasonalble that people would be more alert. One other thing, if you are in a town that you have never been to before to shoot pictures, it's sometimes a good idea to find the local police station, stop in, and let them know who you are where you will be, and what you will be doing. Nine times out of ten, the dispatcher will let the officers on the street know about you, and you shouldn't have any problems. And, then above all, it depends on the officer's attitude, and your attitude toward the officer. Overall, though, my experiences have always been pleasant, and never any problems.

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Back in '95, I had won a music contest thingy and was flown out to Vancouver for a few days. I hated all the 'schmoozin' and 'whor...' ahem. Anyhoo, the CP yards were right outside this glitzy waterfront center, and I could see these glorious old Pullman cars sitting down there. I went through Gastown a bit and found an opening onto the yard, which I thought was deserted?
These cars were amazing, and all of a sudden this guy shows up out of nowhere and asks pleasently 'Can I help you?'. Thankfully, I was in a suit all dolled up - but I think my hair was rather Kurt Cobain-ish? I explained that I admired the cars from this music venue and came down for a look. They were in fact the CP Executive Cars just back from hauling the President of Hong Kong Bank across Canada on a private tour! And this yard chap was kind enough to give me a quick tour at that! Beat the heck out of rock and roll that weekend, that's for sure! But nowadays with all these 'urban gangbangin' hip-hop poppin'' jerks, drug addicts and homeless people hangin around under bridges, and then the internal/external terrorist threats and/or actions, I can't imagine what goes through an engineers mind as he passes a group of kids with their backs turned to him, or a person pacing back and forth waiting on a overpass for something? I wish Colin Powell could ride in every cab, and go out on deck with a shotgun passing these creeps and holler 'Do not shame this train, or you'll taste something you're not going to like!' Hard to imagine kids used to get excited and wave at trains. At worst, throw a rock or mud bombs at boxcars.National Geographics episode 'Love Those Trains' has a segment of an engineer bringing a train into Chicago, and believe even has to have a cop on board now through the city? And these stupid hip hop kids hanging by the tracks with their backs turned to the train. The poor engineer got pretty excited, but thankfully nothing happened then. But how many trains don't have a cop or camera crew on board?Sickening state of progression we're in.

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I belive all of these events are due to idiotic teens and kids thinking that trains are almost "Armored" and they cannot do anything to the trains.im old enough to drive now
premium add-ons

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LAST EDITED ON May-31-02 AT 12:44 PM (EDT)LAST EDITED ON May-31-02 AT 12:37 PM (EDT)Quote: Luckily the US has had the sense to keep the death penalty
Response:Spend some time on this site, please:http://www.tdcj.state.tx.us/stat/deathrow.htmSee if you don't moderate your death row opinion as a result. B.Edit: not trying to be a jerk or anything. That site, from the state of Texas, is one of the most chilling things I've ever read. I first found it a few years ago, and it has stayed with me.

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>Quote:
>
>Luckily the US has had the
>sense to keep the death
>penalty
>
>
>Response:
>
>Spend some time on this site,
>please:
>
>http://www.tdcj.state.tx.us/stat/deathrow.htm
>
>See if you don't moderate your
>death row opinion as a
>result.
>
>B.
>
>Edit: not trying to be
>a jerk or anything.
>That site, from the state
>of Texas, is one of
>the most chilling things I've
>ever read. I first
>found it a few years
>ago, and it has stayed
>with me.
I checked out the site. If it was intended to arouse in me any sympathy for the predatory vermin who are a plague on our society, it failed.Anthony

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